Author Topic: Porting Games Bounties  (Read 2309 times)

Jim Goose (OP)

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Porting Games Bounties
« on: October 30, 2019, 03:26:04 am »
http://hg.icculus.org/icculus/lugaru/

Porting Bounty: Anyone that ports Lugaru to the RG350 will get 100 dollars.

Edit: The bounties are not currently active anymore.
« Last Edit: November 18, 2019, 04:51:56 am by Jim Goose »
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gameblabla

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Re: Porting Games Bounties
« Reply #1 on: October 30, 2019, 12:39:28 pm »
http://hg.icculus.org/icculus/lugaru/

Porting Bounty: Anyone that ports Lugaru to the RG350 will get 100 dollars.
I already attempted Lugaru on the GCW0 and that game needs better 3D drivers because it would not work properly.

Jim Goose (OP)

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Re: Porting Games Bounties
« Reply #2 on: October 30, 2019, 03:48:51 pm »
Which is why I am offering a bit of money for it.
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Jim Goose (OP)

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Re: Porting Games Bounties
« Reply #3 on: November 10, 2019, 02:55:42 pm »
New 100 dollar bounty for Dark Engine
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gameblabla

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Re: Porting Games Bounties
« Reply #4 on: November 10, 2019, 03:48:18 pm »
Don't you mean The Dark Mod ?
Dark Engine's source code was never released to the public.

I guess one could port The Dark Mod with gl4es to the GCW0 but you will have to use an older version of it
and it will run very slowly on it so it won't be a pleasant experience.

Why make unreasonable demands ? That money will go nowhere.

Jim Goose (OP)

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Re: Porting Games Bounties
« Reply #5 on: November 11, 2019, 12:14:03 am »
Don't you mean The Dark Mod ?
Dark Engine's source code was never released to the public.

I guess one could port The Dark Mod with gl4es to the GCW0 but you will have to use an older version of it
and it will run very slowly on it so it won't be a pleasant experience.

Why make unreasonable demands ? That money will go nowhere.

No, the Dark Engine for thief was leaked. It was found in a less than usable format. So this was looking to fix it and make it run on other platforms. https://github.com/volca02/openDarkEngine

There are other things that leaked as well. I will have to do some searching, but it is out there.

You are right though, DarkPlaces would be a waste of time.

EDIT: Just one of the links I stumbled upon when I searched the thief " dark engine" source code. Looks to be in a more complete condition than I expected.
https://www.ttlg.com/forums/showthread.php?t=142681
« Last Edit: November 11, 2019, 12:26:14 am by Jim Goose »
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Jim Goose (OP)

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Re: Porting Games Bounties
« Reply #6 on: November 11, 2019, 11:26:33 pm »
New bounty for n64. 50 dollars for a quicker n64 emulator.
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Surkow

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Re: Porting Games Bounties
« Reply #7 on: November 12, 2019, 12:40:57 am »
New bounty for n64. 50 dollars for a quicker n64 emulator.
You should try to create more constructive/feasible bounties. I would suggest to start with a bounty to port GlideN64 to the GCW Zero/RG-350. The dynarec portion is unlikely to get any faster than it currently is.

Jim Goose (OP)

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Re: Porting Games Bounties
« Reply #8 on: November 12, 2019, 02:04:39 am »
New bounty for n64. 50 dollars for a quicker n64 emulator.
You should try to create more constructive/feasible bounties. I would suggest to start with a bounty to port GlideN64 to the GCW Zero/RG-350. The dynarec portion is unlikely to get any faster than it currently is.

What do you mean constructive? I most assuredly think that Lugaru and the System Shock 2 engine are well within what the RG350 can do. Sure it will be a bit of work, but it'll be worth it.

Well, I did not know what went into it. I only wanted something a bit quicker than what we have. That would be a great option. Anything that makes it quicker. I know that having a fully functioning and up to speed emulator will require cut corners and a lot of optimization. But I am confident it will happen. Someone also talked about a speed boost from implementing the new drivers.

Edit: At least 15 frames or so instead of 5 frames.
« Last Edit: November 12, 2019, 02:07:17 am by Jim Goose »
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Surkow

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Re: Porting Games Bounties
« Reply #9 on: November 12, 2019, 11:57:04 am »
New bounty for n64. 50 dollars for a quicker n64 emulator.
You should try to create more constructive/feasible bounties. I would suggest to start with a bounty to port GlideN64 to the GCW Zero/RG-350. The dynarec portion is unlikely to get any faster than it currently is.

What do you mean constructive? I most assuredly think that Lugaru and the System Shock 2 engine are well within what the RG350 can do. Sure it will be a bit of work, but it'll be worth it.

Well, I did not know what went into it. I only wanted something a bit quicker than what we have. That would be a great option. Anything that makes it quicker. I know that having a fully functioning and up to speed emulator will require cut corners and a lot of optimization. But I am confident it will happen. Someone also talked about a speed boost from implementing the new drivers.

Edit: At least 15 frames or so instead of 5 frames.
Bounties should be feasible and grounded in reality. Some projects take years to complete with multiple developers involved. Most of the ports you see out in the wild do not involve rewriting engines or graphics stacks, or creating dynarecs.

An updated version of Etnaviv (the GPU driver) is not guaranteed to speed up anything. It requires a switch from the framebuffer to a DRM/KMS driver. What you can expect is a more complete driver compared to the initial release of the Etnaviv driver.

N64 emulation is wholly different beast than PSX emulation. If anyone is interested in working on the bounty I would recommend them read this thread first.

Jim Goose (OP)

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Re: Porting Games Bounties
« Reply #10 on: November 12, 2019, 02:04:43 pm »
Yeah, but think of it as an incentive for more development.
I find most of this to be feasible. Just might require a little bit of effort. I think even Dreamcast is possible with some cut corners.
In the end, if what I am offering is not for you, I understand. Just something to get more development going.
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pcercuei

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Re: Porting Games Bounties
« Reply #11 on: November 12, 2019, 02:43:13 pm »
Yeah, but think of it as an incentive for more development.
I find most of this to be feasible. Just might require a little bit of effort. I think even Dreamcast is possible with some cut corners.
In the end, if what I am offering is not for you, I understand. Just something to get more development going.
Nebuleon, which is nothing short of a genius, had to rewrite the dynarec six times before finding the best design, and his last iteration took several years to get to the current point.

$50 would be his hourly salary. Even for $2000 I woudn't do it.

Jim Goose (OP)

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Re: Porting Games Bounties
« Reply #12 on: November 12, 2019, 08:10:13 pm »
Yeah, but think of it as an incentive for more development.
I find most of this to be feasible. Just might require a little bit of effort. I think even Dreamcast is possible with some cut corners.
In the end, if what I am offering is not for you, I understand. Just something to get more development going.
Nebuleon, which is nothing short of a genius, had to rewrite the dynarec six times before finding the best design, and his last iteration took several years to get to the current point.

$50 would be his hourly salary. Even for $2000 I woudn't do it.

You do not have to, but maybe someone else might pick it up. Who knows? They are just incentives.
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SeongGino

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Re: Porting Games Bounties
« Reply #13 on: November 12, 2019, 11:03:27 pm »
You do not have to, but maybe someone else might pick it up. Who knows? They are just incentives.

We appreciate the thought, but you should realize that what you're pitching as 'bounties' barely account for maybe 5% of the budget required to make these things a reality; especially considering that the asking projects in question are not necessarily within the realm of possibility for the system in its current state.

For context, this bounty for a native renderer for PSP games on the PS Vita is topped up at the moment at $700, and the bounty to introduce an aarch64 dynamic recompiler to an already existing emulator core in Mupen64+ finished at $2,155.
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Jim Goose (OP)

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Re: Porting Games Bounties
« Reply #14 on: November 13, 2019, 05:44:40 am »
You do not have to, but maybe someone else might pick it up. Who knows? They are just incentives.

We appreciate the thought, but you should realize that what you're pitching as 'bounties' barely account for maybe 5% of the budget required to make these things a reality; especially considering that the asking projects in question are not necessarily within the realm of possibility for the system in its current state.

For context, this bounty for a native renderer for PSP games on the PS Vita is topped up at the moment at $700, and the bounty to introduce an aarch64 dynamic recompiler to an already existing emulator core in Mupen64+ finished at $2,155.

Hmmm. I suppose so. Now explain to me what would be hard about the Lugaru one and the System Shock Engine? I would like to understand, so I can get a grasp on things.
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exorio

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Re: Porting Games Bounties
« Reply #15 on: November 13, 2019, 05:58:27 am »
Yeah, but think of it as an incentive for more development.
I find most of this to be feasible. Just might require a little bit of effort. I think even Dreamcast is possible with some cut corners.
In the end, if what I am offering is not for you, I understand. Just something to get more development going.

whaaa? dreamcast?

on my i7 laptop dreamcast emulation isn't perfect

by bounties like this, what's the indicator for a project to be finished?

Say someone managed to port n64, it can play some crappy game, but it failed to run goldeneye and mario64 or very poorly?

Or system shock runs but very glitchy?

Do you want to pay them monthly in order to iron out all the bugs or add more game support to the emulator ported?

Honestly IMHO you better off funding people here on their patreon, paypal or whatsoever subscribtion plan/account they have.

exorio

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Re: Porting Games Bounties
« Reply #16 on: November 13, 2019, 06:03:43 am »
You do not have to, but maybe someone else might pick it up. Who knows? They are just incentives.

We appreciate the thought, but you should realize that what you're pitching as 'bounties' barely account for maybe 5% of the budget required to make these things a reality; especially considering that the asking projects in question are not necessarily within the realm of possibility for the system in its current state.

For context, this bounty for a native renderer for PSP games on the PS Vita is topped up at the moment at $700, and the bounty to introduce an aarch64 dynamic recompiler to an already existing emulator core in Mupen64+ finished at $2,155.

Hmmm. I suppose so. Now explain to me what would be hard about the Lugaru one and the System Shock Engine? I would like to understand, so I can get a grasp on things.

I'm not a coder, but I did involved in creating some games

believe me, there're shit tons of things to do

and when it's done, something else came up (bugs and such)

After that polished, the performance was crap

optimized the thing but then agan back to square one, new problem appeared, etc, etc.

You're talking about porting a source meant for one system, to another entirely different system. Did you ever wonder why video game ports need to be done by A WHOLE STUDIO instead of a one man army coder?

Specially back then, at simpler days of 3D video games, say early 2000?

Jim Goose (OP)

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Re: Porting Games Bounties
« Reply #17 on: November 13, 2019, 07:10:33 pm »
Yeah, but think of it as an incentive for more development.
I find most of this to be feasible. Just might require a little bit of effort. I think even Dreamcast is possible with some cut corners.
In the end, if what I am offering is not for you, I understand. Just something to get more development going.

whaaa? dreamcast?

on my i7 laptop dreamcast emulation isn't perfect

by bounties like this, what's the indicator for a project to be finished?

Say someone managed to port n64, it can play some crappy game, but it failed to run goldeneye and mario64 or very poorly?

Or system shock runs but very glitchy?

Do you want to pay them monthly in order to iron out all the bugs or add more game support to the emulator ported?

Honestly IMHO you better off funding people here on their patreon, paypal or whatsoever subscribtion plan/account they have.

That is quite odd because Dreamcast can run on my Intel atom z3735f with some adjustments. What i7 do you have?

I would accept that. If you got the n64 emulator to play something at a reasonable frame rate. I would use OOT as an example of something I'd like running. To me the "ground work" is laid out.

Yeah, I believe if you can have system shock 2 run with minor glitches to the shadows that would be fabulously great. Generally speaking, if I can actually play the game and enjoy it, that is what counts. If you gotta remove shadows or little things to get it running so be it. As long as it is still enjoyable to play. Not just for me, but for everyone.

These bounties are mostly ones that I would consider easier. The source code is there and ready. One forum post on openmw I saw someone run that at 5fps with all the textures missing because the compression standard wasn't compatible or something. That would be something I'd pay higher for if I actually wanted or thought it was feasible to port on this system. But I do not want to do a bounty for openmw at this time.

Monthly is not something I'd do. Lump sums are always better.
« Last Edit: November 13, 2019, 07:12:12 pm by Jim Goose »
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SeongGino

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Re: Porting Games Bounties
« Reply #18 on: November 13, 2019, 08:30:59 pm »
Hmmm. I suppose so. Now explain to me what would be hard about the Lugaru one and the System Shock Engine? I would like to understand, so I can get a grasp on things.

Modern (by the standards of the '00's) 3D engines are more than what this system's current hardware state and GPU support can handle. Same for SS2; SS1 could be feasible (I think?), but the controls would be far from optimal as that's very clearly a PC oriented game that doesn't have a console release to base an alternative control scheme off of.

Short and to the point, if you think it's so easy to port something, I'd like to gladly see your Github repos and compiled binary packages to see how they run. Until you have that experience under your belt, you frankly don't, and shouldn't, have the right to determine what's considered 'easy' or not for this hardware, especially when you're talking about GPU-heavy ports on a system whose biggest handicap is its graphical performance.
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exorio

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Re: Porting Games Bounties
« Reply #19 on: November 13, 2019, 10:14:11 pm »
That is quite odd because Dreamcast can run on my Intel atom z3735f with some adjustments. What i7 do you have?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NP4IMX1SzAc

that's not even remotely "playable" to my definition  ;D

and that is from a very easy release title, daytona

Yes I'm picky but i like my games runs buttery smooth, thank you

Quote
I would accept that. If you got the n64 emulator to play something at a reasonable frame rate. I would use OOT as an example of something I'd like running. To me the "ground work" is laid out.

Yeah, I believe if you can have system shock 2 run with minor glitches to the shadows that would be fabulously great. Generally speaking, if I can actually play the game and enjoy it, that is what counts. If you gotta remove shadows or little things to get it running so be it. As long as it is still enjoyable to play. Not just for me, but for everyone.

These bounties are mostly ones that I would consider easier. The source code is there and ready. One forum post on openmw I saw someone run that at 5fps with all the textures missing because the compression standard wasn't compatible or something. That would be something I'd pay higher for if I actually wanted or thought it was feasible to port on this system. But I do not want to do a bounty for openmw at this time.

Monthly is not something I'd do. Lump sums are always better.

my point is, even with the source code out there, porting a game from a system to another system isn't a breeze.

Even if there is a guy out there who is willing to do it for that amount of money, you'll probably ended up with half assed emulator/games that won't be maintained in coming years.

There's surely a reason why the source code is out there for years but ports aren't done yet. If it's doable, you should have it by now without these bounties (i.e doom ports)

so if you really have money to spare for these kind of stuff, you should donate it to someone who actually already contributed to the community.

 

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