Author Topic: Nintendo Switch  (Read 14010 times)

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Re: Nintendo Switch
« Reply #20 on: October 21, 2016, 02:55:01 am »
Quote
Nintendo Switch is powered by the performance of the custom Tegra processor. The high-efficiency scalable processor includes an NVIDIA GPU based on the same architecture as the world?s top-performing GeForce gaming graphics cards.
I think that pretty much confirms it - full power when docked, energy efficient when on portable with lower res and maybe lower framerate.
As with all Nintendo portable consoles, I expect it to have a 4-5 hour lasting battery (projected) but actually lasting 6-8 hours under regular use.
Also, Shield Portable 2.0 confirmed!! It's a Nintendo console, but it's also the nVidia one we've always wanted.

The more I think about the d-pad issue, the more it makes sense if they are shifting the focus to 3D games, rather than 2D or fighting games - in most 3D games, the d-pad is used for item select. Heck, even 2D games nowadays utilize the analog stick for precise movement, such as the aptly named twin-stick shooters, so them replacing the d-pad becomes even more logical.
This even bring the possibility of playing local co-op or competitive console games without a TV, which is totally unprecedented. Aside from innovation, it also expands their target market to impoverished areas of the world, where most people cannot play with new consoles because they don't have HDMI-capable devices, or big-screen devices at all!
So yeah, this totally has me hooked - this isn't just the hype, I'm stunned by Nintendo's design and their ability to break new ground time after time.

konpia

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Re: Nintendo Switch
« Reply #21 on: October 21, 2016, 03:20:26 am »
Well, it is a bold move to ditch the dpad (for handheld mode) as most games are still played better with the dpad. Personally, I would not be splitting the joy-con controller for 2 players on the go. Maybe, Nintendo gonna have a diff joy-con with dpad that can be bought separately? I don't see myself playing (as console mode) using the joy-con and the 2nd player is using the pro controller, it is just not a fair play, especially in racing, sport or fighting games. And no touch screen?
« Last Edit: October 21, 2016, 03:22:47 am by konpia »

LordDavon

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Re: Nintendo Switch
« Reply #22 on: October 21, 2016, 03:27:09 am »
So yeah, this totally has me hooked - this isn't just the hype, I'm stunned by Nintendo's design and their ability to break new ground time after time.

I really love this.  It is the "new Wii", as I see it.  I don't mean that it will have the same features.  What I mean is that it is designed to be your "other" console.  They are not trying to compete with the PS4 or XBOne.  They are trying to create a device that sits next to your console, like the Wii did.  I think it is a brilliant strategy.

The Wii was the one console that almost everyone I knew had.  It didn't matter if they had an Xbox or Playstation, the Wii was never part of their bias towards either system.  It was just the Wii, and it sold millions.  It did the things the other two systems didn't, and would just coexist.

The Wii-U was a neat concept, but never really broke free from the TV.  While you could use it with just the tablet-like controller, most games were designed to display different information on the tablet controller and the TV.  It is like a console version of the 3DS.  This means that using it without the TV meant hitting the Switch button to swap displays.  As well, you could never get very far from your TV, so you were still stuck to the room the TV was in.

The Switch breaks free of those limitations.  By making the tablet the console, you are no longer tethered to the game system.  The Nvidia chip is is hopefullygoing to give it some nice graphic capabilities, and the cartridge system means you shouldn't need to install half the DVD to the hard drive, just to run the game.

I'm impressed with what I've seen so far.  If it plays well enough as a tablet, I think they will have another hit on their hands.

SONY (OP)

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Re: Nintendo Switch
« Reply #23 on: October 21, 2016, 04:33:37 am »
Maybe android gaming is the way forward, just need to have better games & gamepad support. And also docking equipment for TV game play. Emulators are good for retro gaming and play store for modern gaming.

It's not Android at all.
Also, the screen is a capacitive touch screen.
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Re: Nintendo Switch
« Reply #24 on: October 21, 2016, 04:58:21 am »
SONY, how do you know that the Switch's screen is a touchscreen? The fact that it deactivates for console-play suggests otherwise. AFAIK there is no motion control integrated within it, that's why it's so great - it doesn't have any gimmicks tied to how it actually handles, meaning (!!) that you can port anything from the other consoles to it, unlike the Wii's and Wii U's gimmicks.

Something of note: Inspecting the way everyone holds the controllers, I think the inner part of each of the joy-cons houses a secret L and R buttons. Meaning that they'll be fully capable of running SNES games, at least from a control perspective.
https://www.imore.com/sites/imore.com/files/styles/larger/public/field/image/2016/10/nintendoswitch-multiplayer3.jpg
http://cdn.gamer-network.net/2016/usgamer/Nintendo-Switch-Shot-05.jpg

SONY (OP)

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Re: Nintendo Switch
« Reply #25 on: October 21, 2016, 05:36:38 am »
MIC, I apologise and stand corrected, as I was just making assumptions. So, you're right! Screen isn't a touch screen.
All your points are valid and 100% with them.
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konpia

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Re: Nintendo Switch
« Reply #26 on: October 21, 2016, 05:56:37 am »
MIC, you have keen eyes on the hidden L & R buttons. We have to just wait & see if Nintendo do reveal more details as time goes. Maybe they have more detachable accessories/modules yet to be revealed.

LordDavon

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Re: Nintendo Switch
« Reply #27 on: October 21, 2016, 06:09:28 am »
MIC, I apologise and stand corrected, as I was just making assumptions. So, you're right! Screen isn't a touch screen.
All your points are valid and 100% with them.
Actually, Nintendo isn't stating that it has one or not.  According to ArsTechnica, here is Nintendo's reply when asked, "We have nothing to announce on this topic. We will make additional announcements about the Nintendo Switch hardware later, before the launch of the product."

http://arstechnica.com/gaming/2016/10/nintendo-switchs-apparent-lack-of-touchscreen-isnt-an-accident/

It could mean that it has one, but they do not want to focus on it.  Since it can't be accessed when docked, a touchsceen isn't something they want used while developing console titles.  It may be something they allow for more simple games, to help compete with mobile games, and for keyboard input.  It could also mean that they haven't decided on it yet.

It would be nice if the unit allowed certain tablet functions.  They show someone on a plane with it, so it just makes sense to allow web browsing and other applications to be used from the screen.  When on-the-go, using the controllers to navigate the web would suck.
« Last Edit: October 21, 2016, 06:14:21 am by LordDavon »

vcoleiro1

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Re: Nintendo Switch
« Reply #28 on: October 21, 2016, 07:32:18 am »
This is my random thoughts and questions on the switch

1) How long does the battery last in the tablet when gaming with it

2) What happens to the whole console if you damage the tablet portion, is the whole thing then cactus. Seems so, given Nintendo said the main HW is in the tablet bit and the dock is primarily for connectivity

3) Is there a 3DS successor planned , if so , how will the switch effect sales of it. Or is the switch meant as a console and 3DS replacement

4) When you remove the controller portions from the tablet, like in the ad when he is on the plane. Unless you also carry the central controller connector, the controller must be used as two halfs. Needing a central connector for the controller IMO is kind of crap, it affects portability by needing to carry it around. More importantly , its a pain in the ass to have to dig it out of your bag and setup the controller.

5)  The more I think about this, the less Im feeling for it. Look at the dpad, or should I say lack of, it's just 4 game buttons . I can see why they did this (so both sides of the controller are equal and be used by two players), but it's still bad.

6) Apparently the pro controller will have a proper dpad from what i've heard, if so, not sure how devs would deal with the difference . Are they really going to develop a game that works better with a controller that's optional - by that I mean, make use of diagonal movement which is achievable on the pro controller and not the standard.


Also, I can see now why Nvidia didn't release a follow up to the Shield Portable (or even Tablet) . Which leads me to my biggest concern. The Nintendo Switch just seems to be a next level Shield tablet with detachable controller (like the Ipega 9023 used with the current Shield tablet) . How is that innovative. . The only innovative thing I can see, is that the controller can split in two for two player use. That in itself , like with the Apple TV, suggests devs will code for the lowest denominator - a half controller ie a stick and buttons. It's seems a very segmented platform for devs to develop for.

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Re: Nintendo Switch
« Reply #29 on: October 21, 2016, 08:45:59 am »
1) How long does the battery last in the tablet when gaming with it
It isn't known yet. More details will be revealed closer to release.

2) What happens to the whole console if you damage the tablet portion, is the whole thing then cactus. Seems so, given Nintendo said the main HW is in the tablet bit and the dock is primarily for connectivity
You're right, but that should be a given. Also, Nintendo consoles are tough as bricks - the 3DS can survive 30 foot drops with only scratches.

3) Is there a 3DS successor planned , if so , how will the switch effect sales of it. Or is the switch meant as a console and 3DS replacement
As it seems right now, this isn't Nintendo's next-gen handheld. With their current partnerships, it's possible they'll move either consolidate some of their handheld divisions into the Switch, and some will develop games and accessories for smartphones (as done with the partnership with Apple).

4) When you remove the controller portions from the tablet, like in the ad when he is on the plane. Unless you also carry the central controller connector, the controller must be used as two halfs. Needing a central connector for the controller IMO is kind of crap, it affects portability by needing to carry it around. More importantly , its a pain in the ass to have to dig it out of your bag and setup the controller.
It probably won't be necessary. The centerpiece is more comfortable, granted, but anyone who has used the Wiimote + Nunchuck can tell you that that control scheme is totally viable.

5)  The more I think about this, the less Im feeling for it. Look at the dpad, or should I say lack of, it's just 4 game buttons . I can see why they did this (so both sides of the controller are equal and be used by two players), but it's still bad.
I don't really agree, seeing that even 2D platformers use the analogs nowadays over the d-pad (Guacamelee! comes to mind), and while I do like playing with the d-pad, it's not a central feature anymore. Especially if Nintendo doesn't fuck up and brings back the GameCube analogs, with their hexagonal edges that let you execute PERFECT diagonals, horizontals and verticals.

6) Apparently the pro controller will have a proper dpad from what i've heard, if so, not sure how devs would deal with the difference . Are they really going to develop a game that works better with a controller that's optional - by that I mean, make use of diagonal movement which is achievable on the pro controller and not the standard.
Again, not an issue if you use the analogs as the main way to control your character. The d-pad is relegated to secondary control structures, quickswitch and button replacement nowadays. This is especially true when you separate the two Joy Cons and use one of them horizontally - the analog stick is your d-pad in this weird SNES controller.

How is that innovative.
1. It lets you play current-gen console games on the go.
2. It lets you play console games without a TV.
3. It has built-in support for multiplayer WITHOUT any added accessories.
4. It uses an nVidia GPU in a console.
5. For Nintendo, the control scheme is actually sane for the first time since the GameCube.
6. Multiplayer will have more simplistic, SNES-like controls, while the singleplayer will have a full control scheme - letting even less experienced players enjoy the game without having all of its complexity, without actually handicapping the core experience. (This is ingenious, if it actually works)
7. It isn't the GPD Win and screws over IGG backers. ;)

EDIT: By the way, if anyone wonders why am I supporting it so much aside from just being hyped, it's because of the recent failures of Nintendo - the Wii which failed hardcore gamers, and the Wii U. Both of those failed because they were too esoteric and weak to develop games for, and now Nintendo turns around and develops something that's both innovative and has all the right conservative aspects at the same time.
But still, it is haunted by the reputation of the past systems, leading to videos like this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9SaQ9kJV8w0
Which say "Nintendo lied!" when they promised 3rd party support, which is not only out of their control, the supposed games they promised were by studios that went bankrupt midway through development (Metro: Last Light, 4A Games) or by publishers powerful enough to do whatever they wanted, and they didn't want to develop for a system with a smaller audience (Ubisoft and EA, for example).
So I'm going to support this until it's released and then it can prove itself to be worth it. That way we have a good chance to get a system that isn't filled with shovelware (Wii) or is barren (Wii U), and that is actually good on its own right too.
« Last Edit: October 21, 2016, 09:24:24 am by Made in China »

NTMBK

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Re: Nintendo Switch
« Reply #30 on: October 21, 2016, 09:43:51 am »
You know what I really want from this? Google Chrome. If it has a proper, state of the art, up-to-date web browser, and not some crummy Nintendo special, then I can actually use this to replace my tablet.

SONY (OP)

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Re: Nintendo Switch
« Reply #31 on: October 21, 2016, 09:55:38 am »
Yeah, I love Chrome too.

1) How long does the battery last in the tablet when gaming with it
It isn't known yet. More details will be revealed closer to release.

2) What happens to the whole console if you damage the tablet portion, is the whole thing then cactus. Seems so, given Nintendo said the main HW is in the tablet bit and the dock is primarily for connectivity
You're right, but that should be a given. Also, Nintendo consoles are tough as bricks - the 3DS can survive 30 foot drops with only scratches.

3) Is there a 3DS successor planned , if so , how will the switch effect sales of it. Or is the switch meant as a console and 3DS replacement
As it seems right now, this isn't Nintendo's next-gen handheld. With their current partnerships, it's possible they'll move either consolidate some of their handheld divisions into the Switch, and some will develop games and accessories for smartphones (as done with the partnership with Apple).

4) When you remove the controller portions from the tablet, like in the ad when he is on the plane. Unless you also carry the central controller connector, the controller must be used as two halfs. Needing a central connector for the controller IMO is kind of crap, it affects portability by needing to carry it around. More importantly , its a pain in the ass to have to dig it out of your bag and setup the controller.
It probably won't be necessary. The centerpiece is more comfortable, granted, but anyone who has used the Wiimote + Nunchuck can tell you that that control scheme is totally viable.

5)  The more I think about this, the less Im feeling for it. Look at the dpad, or should I say lack of, it's just 4 game buttons . I can see why they did this (so both sides of the controller are equal and be used by two players), but it's still bad.
I don't really agree, seeing that even 2D platformers use the analogs nowadays over the d-pad (Guacamelee! comes to mind), and while I do like playing with the d-pad, it's not a central feature anymore. Especially if Nintendo doesn't fuck up and brings back the GameCube analogs, with their hexagonal edges that let you execute PERFECT diagonals, horizontals and verticals.

6) Apparently the pro controller will have a proper dpad from what i've heard, if so, not sure how devs would deal with the difference . Are they really going to develop a game that works better with a controller that's optional - by that I mean, make use of diagonal movement which is achievable on the pro controller and not the standard.
Again, not an issue if you use the analogs as the main way to control your character. The d-pad is relegated to secondary control structures, quickswitch and button replacement nowadays. This is especially true when you separate the two Joy Cons and use one of them horizontally - the analog stick is your d-pad in this weird SNES controller.

How is that innovative.
1. It lets you play current-gen console games on the go.
2. It lets you play console games without a TV.
3. It has built-in support for multiplayer WITHOUT any added accessories.
4. It uses an nVidia GPU in a console.
5. For Nintendo, the control scheme is actually sane for the first time since the GameCube.
6. Multiplayer will have more simplistic, SNES-like controls, while the singleplayer will have a full control scheme - letting even less experienced players enjoy the game without having all of its complexity, without actually handicapping the core experience. (This is ingenious, if it actually works)
7. It isn't the GPD Win and screws over IGG backers. ;)

EDIT: By the way, if anyone wonders why am I supporting it so much aside from just being hyped, it's because of the recent failures of Nintendo - the Wii which failed hardcore gamers, and the Wii U. Both of those failed because they were too esoteric and weak to develop games for, and now Nintendo turns around and develops something that's both innovative and has all the right conservative aspects at the same time.
But still, it is haunted by the reputation of the past systems, leading to videos like this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9SaQ9kJV8w0
Which say "Nintendo lied!" when they promised 3rd party support, which is not only out of their control, the supposed games they promised were by studios that went bankrupt midway through development (Metro: Last Light, 4A Games) or by publishers powerful enough to do whatever they wanted, and they didn't want to develop for a system with a smaller audience (Ubisoft and EA, for example).
So I'm going to support this until it's released and then it can prove itself to be worth it. That way we have a good chance to get a system that isn't filled with shovelware (Wii) or is barren (Wii U), and that is actually good on its own right too.

Brilliant! Once again, I 100% agree with everything that you've said.
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vcoleiro1

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Re: Nintendo Switch
« Reply #32 on: October 21, 2016, 11:06:34 am »
It's a tablet, you drop it, it breaks.  What then.

No point saying Nintendo consoles in the past have been tough.  This isn't that anymore.   This thing has a large (7 inch?) screen.  You drop that on the screen , it will likely break.

skelton

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Re: Nintendo Switch
« Reply #33 on: October 21, 2016, 11:39:46 am »
For me the size is too big to be considered a handheld, My maximum size for a handheld is Psvita or 3dsXL. I have a shield tablet +ipega and it's a monster to use and uncofortable, like 7 inch android devices (t least for me). Also, the lack of dpad may not be a problem for some people, but it is for me. Yeah, some indie games like Guacamalee can be controlled with analogs, but I prefer a proper good dpad.
Also, the comparison with GPD WIN is strange, they are completely different devices. One is focused in emulators and windows huge catalogue. Switch is a close system so no emulators, and mainly focused on nintendo games which are not much of my interest. GPD WIN and Switch have a different target., I understand nintendo fans buy their new device too. But for me 3ds was a big dissapointment (I rarely use it), and WII and WIIU were quite dissapointing too. The use of ARM with the tegra X1 can be a handicap for third party games, like it happened with WiiU and their powerPC, which supposedly was going to have a good third party support, and lives thanks to nintendo games, but that's it.

I personally won't buy it, unless until a year or so and I can see how it works, and the game catalogue it has. But I see it more as a home console that as a handheld device. I would have preferred a successor of 3ds with better specs but keeping portability.
« Last Edit: October 21, 2016, 11:43:58 am by skelton »
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davidgilmour

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Re: Nintendo Switch
« Reply #34 on: October 21, 2016, 12:19:09 pm »
It's a tablet, you drop it, it breaks.  What then.

No point saying Nintendo consoles in the past have been tough.  This isn't that anymore.   This thing has a large (7 inch?) screen.  You drop that on the screen , it will likely break.
Yeah, normally Nintendo is idiot proof. This one won't be lol.

SONY (OP)

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Re: Nintendo Switch
« Reply #35 on: October 21, 2016, 01:20:12 pm »
Which one is more powerful in terms of GPU power... nVIDIA Shield console or Nintendo Switch?
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vcoleiro1

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Re: Nintendo Switch
« Reply #36 on: October 21, 2016, 01:26:14 pm »
@SONY
No one will know that until they release the specs of the Switch.


I got to tell you, I'm not feeling it for the Switch.    It seems to me, to be nothing more than a gaming tablet that we are all use to .   Hardly innovative.   You know now what happened with Nividia Shield portable and tablet plans.  yep , they  got shelved for the Switch.

This isn't much more than a Nintendo ecosystem driven Nvidia Shield Tablet 2 with an Ipega controller.   

The Wii UI got hate because it was a under powered console cpompared to the others.  This will still be that despite a special launch years later that you would have thought addressed that issue.  You might say, oh but it's innovative.  My response, how is a Shield 2 tablet with detachable controller (ala Ipega 9023 )  innovative .   

Two player gaming with those crappy half controllers, yeah , no thanks

Not feeling it.  The others still look better ie the Xbox Scorpio and PS4 Pro
« Last Edit: October 21, 2016, 01:36:44 pm by vcoleiro1 »

skelton

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Re: Nintendo Switch
« Reply #37 on: October 21, 2016, 01:52:46 pm »
Which one is more powerful in terms of GPU power... nVIDIA Shield console or Nintendo Switch?

If the Switch comes with Tegra X1 as rumoured then it is similar to shield TV, perhaps slightly underclocked to get better battery. tegra X1 is quite hot, in fact in shield TV Box comes with a fan.
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Re: Nintendo Switch
« Reply #38 on: October 21, 2016, 05:40:21 pm »
It's a tablet, you drop it, it breaks.  What then.

No point saying Nintendo consoles in the past have been tough.  This isn't that anymore.   This thing has a large (7 inch?) screen.  You drop that on the screen , it will likely break.
Have you heard of Gorilla Glass? It's scalable to 7'' as shown by devices such as nVidia Shield Tablet. The screen is a non-issue seeing both companies who make the Switch, and if the other parts are as tough as it is, it can be very resilient. The real question is whether it has any moving parts inside of it, although the GameCube could also survive a 30 foot drop and it had a disc reader so I don't know.
We'll know more after it's released of course, but even as it stands right now the industry standard is to have resilient devices with Gorilla Glass and IP rating of 68, so assuming otherwise is uncalled for.

Yeah, some indie games like Guacamalee can be controlled with analogs, but I prefer a proper good dpad.
No, Guacamelee! has to be controlled via analogs because otherwise dodging and activating overdrive mode becomes a pain in the ass. Most of the games nowadays are built around analogs, and I agree that I would like a d-pad for some games - but it's not a must have.
Also, Nintendo has peripherals up the wazoo, with the Switch Pro controller already seen in the video and (like any other console) will have 3rd party controllers, some with d-pads. This might cost your another $20 if they don't ship the Pro controller with it, but it's a very solvable issue.

Also, the comparison with GPD WIN is strange, they are completely different devices.
Dude, I was kidding. I even put a wink emoji there, and I never use emojis.

This isn't much more than a Nintendo ecosystem driven Nvidia Shield Tablet 2 with an Ipega controller.   
That's like saying that the PS4 and the XB1 are just PCs with extreme limitations imposed on their content, which is true. So what? It innovates through integrating all of the concepts that were niche up to this point to a powerful big-name console. It's not like these concepts were bad from the get go, they just had very shitty implementations.

The Wii UI got hate because it was a under powered console cpompared to the others.  This will still be that despite a special launch years later that you would have thought addressed that issue.  You might say, oh but it's innovative.  My response, how is a Shield 2 tablet with detachable controller (ala Ipega 9023 )  innovative .
No, the Wii U got hate because its clunky control scheme that made developers unwanting to develop special version just for it. Power isn't a factor - it wasn't with the Wii which had a shit load of games, and it wasn't with the Wii U where most games were under 4GB but had to be shipped on a BluRay disc because that was the industry standard. Power is only at play if you're striving for realism and have no art design for your game, which might be the case for games like NBA 2kYEAR and the Call of Duty games, but they've already shown one of those running well on it.

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Re: Nintendo Switch
« Reply #39 on: October 21, 2016, 06:27:49 pm »
It's a tablet, you drop it, it breaks.  What then.

No point saying Nintendo consoles in the past have been tough.  This isn't that anymore.   This thing has a large (7 inch?) screen.  You drop that on the screen , it will likely break.
I respect your opinion.  Please don't take this the wrong way.  I'm just not sure I get this.  This could be said for any tablet, and this is really just a tablet with a dock and controller.

I'm seeing this as a $400 machine, which is half the cost of my iPad Air 2 was when it was new.  My Pixel C was $549, and my Shield Tablet was $439 with all the extras when new.  Heck, I even dropped the $300 on the S192 K1.  If they drop, I take them to get the glass replaced.  As long as the digitizer isn't damaged, it doesn't cost more than $80.  If it is, I'm looking at $100 - $200.  My iPad 3 was $140 with the digitizer.

They will make cases for this, and protective sleeves for carrying them.  There looked to be some room in the dock for this to have at least a smart cover.

It's a tablet.  And like any tablet, they can break.  It really doesn't stop the tens of millions high end tablet sales that happen every month.

 

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