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Other Portable Consoles => GPD Windows Devices => Topic started by: SONY on August 26, 2018, 02:36:51 pm
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What do guys 'n' girls want in a/for GPD Win 3?
I wouldn't mind if GPD make two new GPD Wins.
My example description below. All just fun ideas, btw and as far as I know...GPD have ZERO plans to make any of the below.
1. GPD Win 3
Exactly the same form factor as Win 2, only much more powerful.
Stay with the 6 inch 720p screen and 8GB of RAM, but change all other specs.
2. GPD Win TAB 1
This will be a brand new GPD gaming device and can be seen as a spiritual successor to the Razer EDGE pro, only with a less powerful GPU and much smaller in overall size and obviously developed by GPD.
I want it to have the same specs as GPD Win 3, only the form factor will be in pure tablet form + have an 8 inch 1080p screen (with exactly the same size bezels as what Xiaomi Mi Pad 4 has, which is perfect, imo and not too thin) and have a slightly bigger battery.
Of course, it'll have a USB TYPE-C port but the good thing is it'll also have 2x USB 3.0 ports.
It'll be Wacom pen compatible, sold separately.
The thickness will be 8mm, so an ipega PG-9023 gamepad controller can easily be attached and connect via BT.
GPD should also design their own gamepad controller (included free in package) that attaches directly via the USB TYPE-C port (on the side like Gamevice does with iPads and Samsung Galaxy S(x) smartphones), so there's no input lag at all.
Lastly, GPD Win TAB 1 will have advance passive cooling technology.
Example images below. First pic is just the GPD Win TAB, which looks just like every other tablet with an 8 inch screen.
And the second pic is with an ipega gamepad controller (PG-9083, not PG-9023) attached to it (just pretend the tablet is black lol).
(https://image.ibb.co/eGHe59/2018_08_26_23_56_36.jpg)
(https://preview.ibb.co/jXh7sp/2018_08_26_23_58_38.jpg)
So, basically...
GPD Pocket = For UMPC enthusiast who want an 'almost pocketable' PC experience.
GPD Win = For gamers who want a pocketable UMPC with physical gaming controls and a keyboard built-in.
GPD Win TAB = For gamers out there who don't care about having a built-in keyboard (and built-in phyical gaming controls) and also want the freedom of having a pure tablet form factor around with an option to game via gamepad controller.
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Same form factor as win 2 and much more Powerful IS difficult. More Powerful IS a ryzen Apu but they are 25/15w so quite hard to keep it cool in that form factor. Anyway, i wouldn't expect a win 3 until 2020 being generous, so Who knows What Intel and AMD can offer at an affordable proceso by that time.
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Sony you going to buy a Win 3 or going to chicken out like the Win 2 saying its too expensive? ( which I 100% agree).
Its not going to be any cheaper thats for sure.
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I want the GPDwin3 to use a 7" screen, but with smaller bezels. You never realize how small a 6" screen is when ordering, until you have it in your hands. 6" is tiny.
If it has smaller bezels, the win3 can still be roughly the same size. Maybe a little bigger.
I want it to have better cooling, and if they're going to stuck with using SSDs, to use a 2280 ssd. They can do this by going back to a single motherboard. Even making the win3 3-4mm thicker.
If it were a single board, the microHDMI and mSD card could be where the m.2 door is, and the fan/heatsink could be thicker. and cool considerably better.
if the case was just 3-4mm thicker, the m.2 drive could go over the analog sticks (looking at it from the bottom).
A thunderbolt3 port.
More powerful package. This is where i want to say a ryzen ULP APU, but in reality, amd chips just suck at openGL which a lot of emulators still use. So we don't have any current cpu/apus that i'd be happy with atm. maybe intel can make a 4.5watt cpu with hd graphics with 48 or 72 "execution units". Pair that with 2400mhz LPDDR4 memory, and we'd have some serious gaming potential.
Now this one is for a small group of people...
Solder or "test" pads for USB2.0 -D and +D on the motherboard. For people like me that want to micro-mod the system. Personally i want to put a tiny usb NFC/RFID reader in it, right behind the LCD. There's space, i just don't have the usb points to solder to, that i know of.
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Two points:
1-First, that they must wait 5 years to sell the new one.
2-The new GPD must emulate at least PS3 perfectly.
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Unless Intel gets their asses in gear and perfects 10nm while having Raj's dGPU team help the iGPU team improve their crap AND releases a Core M3 soon that benefits from both those things, I think the only option between now and probably late 2019 or early 2020 for GPD to start designing the gen 3 products around would be a Ryzen APU. Maybe one of the embedded V1000 chips, preferably the V1605B so we can have a quad core chip with Vega 8 graphics at 12W. Their other 12W chip, the V1202B, doesn't seem like it would be a worthwhile upgrade over the 7Y30. I'm sure it's better...but not by that much. At least, not as much of a jump as going from the Z8700 to the 7Y30 was.
Anyway, it seems that GPD might be exploring the idea using an AMD chip, so I hope they'll be able to do it. And if they intend to release in 2019/2020 I'm sure they're probably already starting planning. If they realize that they need to go with a higher powered chip like the Ryzen, I would assume that R&D needs to begin NOW, at least, if they intend to release in 2020. Also I'll assume the Win 3 will definitely be bigger, maybe having the same dimensions as the GPD Pocket 1 & 2, but thicker.
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I'm sure it will be a while before they release the GPD Win 3. But, I do not want AMD products, so they should wait until Intel develops a good processor for the next-gen of ultra-micro pcs.
A long time ago, I had a Sony Vaio netbook pc that had an AMD APU processor. AMD discontinued support in the graphics drivers within 2 years of the product's release, along with Sony. (causing a non-backlit screen on the laptop)
Basically, I guess they *could* use AMD, but if they do, they should be very careful about making sure everything works with generic drivers, to improve the ultimate longevity of their device. In my opinion, Intel doesn't seem to abandon their product as easily as AMD, and people always seem to come up with software modifications for Intel gpus.
I don't mean to hate, I just want to share my personal account of using AMD vs Intel processors.
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Win 3:
- Put d-pad and analogue nubs back the right way around
- Make L1&R1 analogue
- Support a fully working version of Android
Tab1 - don't know, not interested in a tab.
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@Pleng
RE: Analogue placements...you want it back to the way it was like on the Win 1?
You reckon, it'd be possible for clickable L3 and R3 nubs/sticks?
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@Pleng
RE: Analogue placements...you want it back to the way it was like on the Win 1?
and every other portable device that's ever had d-pads, face buttons and analogue sticks, yes.
You reckon, it'd be possible for clickable L3 and R3 nubs/sticks?
I don't see why not? But I'd choose a sensible layout over clickable nubs any day.
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Just the fact that the Nintendo Switch is doing Gangbusters should be proof that form factor will sell. And there are thousands of windows games that do not need a native keyboard. Just add a button that will pull up an on screen keyboard and bam... At least that is my opinion.
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@SONY i love your idea for the GPD Win3 and Tab1, it would be nice to have a bigger screen 7 or 8 inch. if only they'll make a GPD Win 3 XL with clickable L3 and R3...
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For the Win 3, I think they should start to move it away from the slimline clamshell design - they already have the Pocket ticking that box. The Win 3 should be just about games and have higher quality controls (including clickable sticks) and better comfort in the hands.
I'd like them to take inspiration from a form factor like the original nVidia Shield Portable; something that sits nicely in your grip and has plenty of room for proper controls. I admit they'd have to make some sacrifices to get the full keyboard in :)
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Get the cost down. That would be the biggest help :)
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Rather than a more powerful win I'd like a cheaper atom based version of the Win 2. The current win is fine for me in terms of performance but the heating problems means I only ever plat it for maybe half an hour at a time. For what I want to play on the Win (VN, RPGMaker games and indie games) the massive increase in price isn't worth it.
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I've skipped Win2 because it's just too expensive.
My Win3 wish list:
- Cheaper
- Clickable L3/R3
- Dpad/analogue in the right place
- Bigger screen
- Bigger battery
- No keyboard (just some extra buttons to map and a virtual keyboard)
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Cheaper is not happening, sorry
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Cheaper is not happening, sorry
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It could.
Just have worse performance (or simply don't improve performance over the Win 2 at all, rendering it pointless), use all cheap quality plastic (as in, plastic bag tier), and don't do any kind of QC. Also completely shut down any kind of customer service at all. People are already having a lot of issues with GPD's level of "customer service", but it does technically exist. But for the "Win 3", don't have any customer service at all. Also, don't accept returns. Period.
That should make the "Win 3" cheaper. That's what these people wanted, right?
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Rather than a more powerful win I'd like a cheaper atom based version of the Win 2. The current win is fine for me in terms of performance but the heating problems means I only ever plat it for maybe half an hour at a time. For what I want to play on the Win (VN, RPGMaker games and indie games) the massive increase in price isn't worth it.
For a company like GPD, designing a new board and opening another production line (and maintaining any form of "support") for a lower tier product might not be worth it. Our best bet for a weaker Win 2 alternative (that's not the now out-of-production Win 1) would be for another Chinese factory to step in to make a clone, just like how the Pocket now has two clones.
A Win clone with the TopJoy Falcon's specs could actually be a pretty cool alternative (just as long as it doesn't fall apart). The Falcon's specs are an Intel Pentium Silver N5000 (basically current gen Atom, just with a new name to hide the fact that it's an Atom) and 8 GB RAM, which would make it a good deal slower than the Win 2, but would still be faster than the Win 1. If someone could do that at maybe $300-350, that might be fair.
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Yes, a company can cloan and make cheaper, but a device called GPD Win 3 will not be cheap. Hopefully a new contender will arive and help open the market, but I'm not holding my breath.
And that is coming from someone who is invested in Devices I will never see.
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Cheaper is not happening, sorry
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Of course it could be... Just remove keyboard and avoid shell form and you have a cheaper device.
GPD has a great profit in that 700$
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Cheaper is not happening, sorry
Sent from my MIX using Tapatalk
Of course it could be... Just remove keyboard and avoid shell form and you have a cheaper device.
GPD has a great profit in that 700$
Enviado desde mi SM-G950F mediante Tapatalk
I was against keyboard at the beginning, but after using it, for me keyboard is just basic, and the touch keyboard is not as comfy as it should be. And I was against the use of keyboard, but now is a must for me. Anyhow, if you look something without a keyboard, smachZ is your choice (if it's released someday....)
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Cheaper is not happening, sorry
Sent from my MIX using Tapatalk
Of course it could be... Just remove keyboard and avoid shell form and you have a cheaper device.
GPD has a great profit in that 700$
Enviado desde mi SM-G950F mediante Tapatalk
I was against keyboard at the beginning, but after using it, for me keyboard is just basic, and the touch keyboard is not as comfy as it should be. And I was against the use of keyboard, but now is a must for me. Anyhow, if you look something without a keyboard, smachZ is your choice (if it's released someday....)
I use it in my Win1, but I could use a virtual keyboard perfectly. It's not "natural" now because of the shell form, but think about PSP/Vita/Swith/tablet/smartphone... If you want a device game, keyboard is not a must.
SmachZ is not an option beacuse it's not a product, so I expect a Win3 wo keyboard.
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PSP or Vita don't run windows. That's the difference. For me a Virtual keyboard is not a solution at all. Can be handy with bad win 1 keyboard, but with the improved win 2 keyboard for me is a must, and I don't conceive using windows without a keyboard. About win 3, it will depend on how GPD focus, but if they want to continue the UMPC factor, then they wlll use a keyboard too, same as Pandora Pyra,.
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Cheaper is not happening, sorry
Sent from my MIX using Tapatalk
Of course it could be... Just remove keyboard and avoid shell form and you have a cheaper device.
GPD has a great profit in that 700$
Enviado desde mi SM-G950F mediante Tapatalk
I was against keyboard at the beginning, but after using it, for me keyboard is just basic, and the touch keyboard is not as comfy as it should be. And I was against the use of keyboard, but now is a must for me. Anyhow, if you look something without a keyboard, smachZ is your choice (if it's released someday....)
I use it in my Win1, but I could use a virtual keyboard perfectly. It's not "natural" now because of the shell form, but think about PSP/Vita/Swith/tablet/smartphone... If you want a device game, keyboard is not a must.
SmachZ is not an option beacuse it's not a product, so I expect a Win3 wo keyboard.
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I agree with Skelton. A physical keyboard is a MUST for a Windows gaming device. You just need it for playing old Windows games and emulators. A good example why a virtual keyboard isn't a good idea is ScummVM for the Dingoo. It still gets updated and you can still use it except for the virtual keyboard. That part is broken and developers didn't know it and now nobody cares to fix it. That makes playing a lot of ScummVM games on the Dingoo impossible because you can't save your progress without a keyboard.
That's just one example but I'm sure there's going to be a lot more and no developer is going to care if you can't use your virtual keyboard on a Windows device.
For the GPD Win 3. I wouldn't mind if it's more like a GPD Win 1.x as long as they keep it affordable. I like my GPD Win and I would like to upgrade it but for me the GPD Win 2 is too expensive.
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Use a Bluetooth KB or USB KB.
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Use a Bluetooth KB or USB KB.
that removes the purpose of a handheld or umpc. Can be a good idea if GPD makes a Win tab or something though.
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Completely agree with Skelton, keyboard is a must. Having everything integrated into one device is the only reason the product line exists in the first place. Cutting out a built in keyboard would limit the device to playing ONLY console ports and retro home console emulation. That's fine for a small segment of their current market, but it'll hurt everyone else including the Chinese and Japanese who tend to play a lot of MMOs and who are GPD's main markets.
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Use a Bluetooth KB or USB KB.
That kind of tip goes both ways. Just get a Windows tablet and a BT or USB game controller.
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I was against a keyboard on the Win one but after getting one it really is handy since even a lot of games with proper controller supports still have quirks which are easier to deal with when you have a real keyboard.
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Completely agree with Skelton, keyboard is a must. Having everything integrated into one device is the only reason the product line exists in the first place. Cutting out a built in keyboard would limit the device to playing ONLY console ports and retro home console emulation. That's fine for a small segment of their current market, but it'll hurt everyone else including the Chinese and Japanese who tend to play a lot of MMOs and who are GPD's main markets.
A LOT of games are gamepad compatible... A LOT. And with 5 or 6 extra buttons you can map and play 99% of not gamepad compatible games. A keyboard is a nice addition, but you can use windows without it. It has a tablet mode for some reason.
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Cheaper is not happening, sorry
Sent from my MIX using Tapatalk
Of course it could be... Just remove keyboard and avoid shell form and you have a cheaper device.
GPD has a great profit in that 700$
Enviado desde mi SM-G950F mediante Tapatalk
I was against keyboard at the beginning, but after using it, for me keyboard is just basic, and the touch keyboard is not as comfy as it should be. And I was against the use of keyboard, but now is a must for me. Anyhow, if you look something without a keyboard, smachZ is your choice (if it's released someday....)
I use it in my Win1, but I could use a virtual keyboard perfectly. It's not "natural" now because of the shell form, but think about PSP/Vita/Swith/tablet/smartphone... If you want a device game, keyboard is not a must.
SmachZ is not an option beacuse it's not a product, so I expect a Win3 wo keyboard.
Enviado desde mi SM-G950F mediante Tapatalk
I agree with Skelton. A physical keyboard is a MUST for a Windows gaming device. You just need it for playing old Windows games and emulators. A good example why a virtual keyboard isn't a good idea is ScummVM for the Dingoo. It still gets updated and you can still use it except for the virtual keyboard. That part is broken and developers didn't know it and now nobody cares to fix it. That makes playing a lot of ScummVM games on the Dingoo impossible because you can't save your progress without a keyboard.
That's just one example but I'm sure there's going to be a lot more and no developer is going to care if you can't use your virtual keyboard on a Windows device.
For the GPD Win 3. I wouldn't mind if it's more like a GPD Win 1.x as long as they keep it affordable. I like my GPD Win and I would like to upgrade it but for me the GPD Win 2 is too expensive.
I play ScummVM games in a mobile. Also in a GPD XD. No problem at all. It works just fine.
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Cheaper is not happening, sorry
Sent from my MIX using Tapatalk
Of course it could be... Just remove keyboard and avoid shell form and you have a cheaper device.
GPD has a great profit in that 700$
Enviado desde mi SM-G950F mediante Tapatalk
I was against keyboard at the beginning, but after using it, for me keyboard is just basic, and the touch keyboard is not as comfy as it should be. And I was against the use of keyboard, but now is a must for me. Anyhow, if you look something without a keyboard, smachZ is your choice (if it's released someday....)
I use it in my Win1, but I could use a virtual keyboard perfectly. It's not "natural" now because of the shell form, but think about PSP/Vita/Swith/tablet/smartphone... If you want a device game, keyboard is not a must.
SmachZ is not an option beacuse it's not a product, so I expect a Win3 wo keyboard.
Enviado desde mi SM-G950F mediante Tapatalk
I agree with Skelton. A physical keyboard is a MUST for a Windows gaming device. You just need it for playing old Windows games and emulators. A good example why a virtual keyboard isn't a good idea is ScummVM for the Dingoo. It still gets updated and you can still use it except for the virtual keyboard. That part is broken and developers didn't know it and now nobody cares to fix it. That makes playing a lot of ScummVM games on the Dingoo impossible because you can't save your progress without a keyboard.
That's just one example but I'm sure there's going to be a lot more and no developer is going to care if you can't use your virtual keyboard on a Windows device.
For the GPD Win 3. I wouldn't mind if it's more like a GPD Win 1.x as long as they keep it affordable. I like my GPD Win and I would like to upgrade it but for me the GPD Win 2 is too expensive.
I play ScummVM games in a mobile. Also in a GPD XD. No problem at all. It works just fine.
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Windows isn't Android. Android is build to run without a keyboard and although Windows can it isn't. I'm pretty sure that if for some reason you won't be able to call the virtual keyboard when you need it for the application you're running the answer is also going to be "Use a physical keyboard".
The GPD Win is a great device as it is. All it needs is improved battery/charging and improved cooling. Everything else isn't imported. It doesn't need to be as powerful as the GPD Win 2 as long as it doesn't cost a lot more than a GPD Win.
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Cheaper is not happening, sorry
Sent from my MIX using Tapatalk
Of course it could be... Just remove keyboard and avoid shell form and you have a cheaper device.
GPD has a great profit in that 700$
Enviado desde mi SM-G950F mediante Tapatalk
I was against keyboard at the beginning, but after using it, for me keyboard is just basic, and the touch keyboard is not as comfy as it should be. And I was against the use of keyboard, but now is a must for me. Anyhow, if you look something without a keyboard, smachZ is your choice (if it's released someday....)
I use it in my Win1, but I could use a virtual keyboard perfectly. It's not "natural" now because of the shell form, but think about PSP/Vita/Swith/tablet/smartphone... If you want a device game, keyboard is not a must.
SmachZ is not an option beacuse it's not a product, so I expect a Win3 wo keyboard.
Enviado desde mi SM-G950F mediante Tapatalk
I agree with Skelton. A physical keyboard is a MUST for a Windows gaming device. You just need it for playing old Windows games and emulators. A good example why a virtual keyboard isn't a good idea is ScummVM for the Dingoo. It still gets updated and you can still use it except for the virtual keyboard. That part is broken and developers didn't know it and now nobody cares to fix it. That makes playing a lot of ScummVM games on the Dingoo impossible because you can't save your progress without a keyboard.
That's just one example but I'm sure there's going to be a lot more and no developer is going to care if you can't use your virtual keyboard on a Windows device.
For the GPD Win 3. I wouldn't mind if it's more like a GPD Win 1.x as long as they keep it affordable. I like my GPD Win and I would like to upgrade it but for me the GPD Win 2 is too expensive.
I play ScummVM games in a mobile. Also in a GPD XD. No problem at all. It works just fine.
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Windows isn't Android. Android is build to run without a keyboard and although Windows can it isn't. I'm pretty sure that if for some reason you won't be able to call the virtual keyboard when you need it for the application you're running the answer is also going to be "Use a physical keyboard".
The GPD Win is a great device as it is. All it needs is improved battery/charging and improved cooling. Everything else isn't imported. It doesn't need to be as powerful as the GPD Win 2 as long as it doesn't cost a lot more than a GPD Win.
Are you talking about Windows 3.11? It's 2018 now... We've Windows smartphones and tablets. Do you mean they are totally unusable w/o keyboard? o_O
If you want to play a game that need a keyboard, you have right analogue to simulate a mouse, left analogue to simulate wasd, dpad (4), ABXY (4), L1/L2/L3 (3), R1/R2/R3 (3), Select/Start (2)... 16 buttons you can map to keys/mouse!! Add a back button and you can map 32 keys with Controller Companion! How many games really need more than 32 keys to be played? 0.01%? none?
I understand you guys feel comfortable with a keyboard. I'm sure you also use Win1/Win2 as UMPC. I don't. I use it to play Steam games (GUI gamepad compatible) and RetroArch (also gamepad compatible).
It's not so difficult to understand someone has different needs.
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in that case that a simple windows tablet with a gamepad attached makes the same purpose to you. I personally prefer it as it is, but as you say, different needs.
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If a company would release a windows gaming tablet with gaming focused specs, that would be great. Closest we ever got was Razer Edge but that failed miserably.
An 8 inch tablet with Win specs or close would be the sweet spot. But it would probably light on fire after a few hours.
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Dear, GPD...
#NoKBplease
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I understand you guys feel comfortable with a keyboard. I'm sure you also use Win1/Win2 as UMPC.
That's right and also because it doesn't matter if Windows 10 is from 2018. A lot of the applications and games aren't so I won't let you remove my keyboard. ;D
Edit: And I also forgot to say that I HATE greasy fingers on my screen.
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Dear, GPD...
#NoKBplease
+1
I understand you guys feel comfortable with a keyboard. I'm sure you also use Win1/Win2 as UMPC.
That's right and also because it doesn't matter if Windows 10 is from 2018. A lot of the applications and games aren't so I won't let you remove my keyboard. ;D
Edit: And I also forgot to say that I HATE greasy fingers on my screen.
XDDD That's a good point
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Some games like TES OBLIVION or TES SKYRIM don't allow binding from other software unless you download the right mod (obse for oblivion), for exemple you can't increase/lower sound or even Alt F4 to quite the game. Don't even think about using virtual Keyboard with those games, it won't even pop on the screen (everything on gpd win 2).
Envoy? de mon G8441 en utilisant Tapatalk
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I and I would assume a good quantity of the Asian market enjoy playing MMOs of various kinds on our Win 2s (PSO2 on Win 1 was also a nice surprise) and having to use an on screen keyboard for those would be cancer. Forget having to figure out how to pull up the keyboard in the first place, having one take up half the screen (and thus covering the text box) and then having to reach up to the screen to frantically peck something out in the middle of any kind of in-game situation....you may as well tell a guy to lop off all his fingers and slam his face onto his keyboard to type instead.
Again, if you just want a gamepad, you could just get a tablet with equivalent specs to whatever the Win 3 will use (I'm sure there will be plenty, just like with the previous Wins) and use one of them iPega things. Hell, you could essentially build your own handheld if you get a tablet and a Linx Vision 8 controller. Someone was able to mod the controller to connect via USB instead of the docking connector and then proceeded to use it for his portable big screen Vita TV handheld.
If GPD were to do a no-KB version (maybe call it the GPD Win Zero), it should be a side product line and NOT be the Win 3. Making a drastic change to the Win line like removing the keyboard would alienate the vast majority of their consumer base.
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I have an idea/suggestion for GPD...
Why not, just make GPD Win 3 into a 2-in-1 (Surface Book style, but with sort of a hinge design) with" virtually bezel-less screen, then everyone is happy :D
#BestOfBothWorlds
(https://preview.ibb.co/mk8jfU/a_HR0c_HM6_Ly9sa_DQu_Z29v_Z2xld_XNlcm_Nvbn_Rlbn_Qu_Y29t_Ly1va2_Fm_Vm_Ix_VFUt_MC9_Wa_WZEbl_JXRGt3_SS9_BQUFBQUFBQUhp_NC9_Dc0_RPb_DRVUXh_OMC93_MTQw_MC1o_Nzg4_LW5v_L2_Jvb2tfa_Glu_Z2_Vf_Z2lm_Xzcw_MF9n_Yl9zb2_Np_YWwu_Z2lm.gif)
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I have an idea/suggestion for GPD...
Why not, just make GPD Win 3 into a 2-in-1 (Surface Book style, but with sort of a hinge design) with" virtually bezel-less screen, then everyone is happy :D
#BestOfBothWorlds
(https://preview.ibb.co/mk8jfU/a_HR0c_HM6_Ly9sa_DQu_Z29v_Z2xld_XNlcm_Nvbn_Rlbn_Qu_Y29t_Ly1va2_Fm_Vm_Ix_VFUt_MC9_Wa_WZEbl_JXRGt3_SS9_BQUFBQUFBQUhp_NC9_Dc0_RPb_DRVUXh_OMC93_MTQw_MC1o_Nzg4_LW5v_L2_Jvb2tfa_Glu_Z2_Vf_Z2lm_Xzcw_MF9n_Yl9zb2_Np_YWwu_Z2lm.gif)
Because that's luxury and it comes at a price. ;)
Also what are you going to do with the controllers?
You can't place them on the keyboard part and if you place them next to the screen the device is going to be much larger than it should be.
#NoKBisFail
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Just think of it as...iControlPad with a dock for a little tablet screen to sit on.
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Just think of it as...iControlPad with a dock for a little tablet screen to sit on.
I know what you mean but what's the point of it?
Is that what people want to replace their GPD Win?
I don't think so. Fix the battery/charging issue, improve the cooling and upgrade the CPU and we've got an affordable device again that can replace our GPD Win. If the performance is somewhere between the GPD Win and GPD Win 2 I'm happy with it.
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There's no battery charging issue, afaik?
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There's no battery charging issue, afaik?
If a battery needs to be replaced within a year something is wrong. I don't believe it's just because of heat that it lost half of it's capacity within a year. I've replaced it with a Liter Energy battery from aliexpress that are supposed to be 6700mAh but only charges up to +/- 4500mAh. I asked the seller if this is right but got no answer. The battery percentage gauge is also not accurate with this battery.
I would've replaced it with a Sunda battery but can't find them anywhere and I also think it's going to be replaced again within a year because something is wrong.
This needs to be researched. Maybe it's just heat and an improved cooling fixes this. If the bottom of the case needs to be thicker for improved cooling that's fine for me.
I would also like a faster SD card reader and maybe 8 GB RAM. The 8 GB RAM I would only need if it's possible to run every Mednafen PSX game at full speed so I can load PSX multi disc games to the memory (fixes drive read delays).
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RE using Windows 8-10 without a keyboard, trust me it's a PITA. I was an early adopter of Bay Trail tablets and had wanted a Windows based gaming solution I could fit in my pocket for ages, before this I had touchscreen laptops so I was familiar with using Windows with touch gestures (and unlike everybody else I actually found it useful) and incorporated them into my normal OS usage.
The problem is that Windows is designed around KB and mouse input, although touch has been reasonably well retro-fitted into the OS it quickly becomes apparent that the many basic tasks and operations a user would perform during day to day use require KB and mouse to make them fast and intuitive. It's quite hard to explain but every time you have use a touch mouse (or analog stick mouse emulation) and/or go into the taskbar to manually bring up the touch keyboard (because it isn't always automatic like Android or IOS) it makes you want to use the device a little less - death by a million cuts so to speak. It becomes a chore to navigate and perform basic operations.
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I have an idea/suggestion for GPD...
Why not, just make GPD Win 3 into a 2-in-1 (Surface Book style, but with sort of a hinge design) with" virtually bezel-less screen, then everyone is happy :D
#BestOfBothWorlds
(https://preview.ibb.co/mk8jfU/a_HR0c_HM6_Ly9sa_DQu_Z29v_Z2xld_XNlcm_Nvbn_Rlbn_Qu_Y29t_Ly1va2_Fm_Vm_Ix_VFUt_MC9_Wa_WZEbl_JXRGt3_SS9_BQUFBQUFBQUhp_NC9_Dc0_RPb_DRVUXh_OMC93_MTQw_MC1o_Nzg4_LW5v_L2_Jvb2tfa_Glu_Z2_Vf_Z2lm_Xzcw_MF9n_Yl9zb2_Np_YWwu_Z2lm.gif)
Hahahahahahahahahuh?
Funny man! So you want to make a already expensive device a lot more expensive?
Why havent you bought a WIN 2 yet? Because it cost too much money right?
So adding a removable keyboard will be a buy while costing hundreds more?
Hahahahahahahahaha
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In GPD's case... thousands more! :D
(https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/001/096/564/2f7.jpg)
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my suggestions:
- Replaced batteries
- without plastic frames screen
- Aluminium shell (bottom too)
- color variants (Like 3DS have)
- cover that facilitates the replacement of parts
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Well...
I won't complain about the GPD Win 2 being a bit too expensive any more. I bought a nearly new GPD Win 2 second hand from a very nice guy on Discord thanks to Faust who told me about it. I never thought I would find one at the price I had to pay for it at least not so soon. :)
Once you own a GPD Win 2 you don't really think about a GPD Win 3 because it is already a big improvement compared to the GPD Win.
But I still think that an upgraded GPD Win would be the better choice because not everyone is going to be as lucky as me and find a GPD Win 2 with an offer you can't refuse. ;)
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I expect quallity of life improve other than just another performance boost.
- I think controller should be place on side of device seperate from main body similar to Nintendo Switch keep player hand away from the heat machine generate and even better if player can detachable this controller from the device.
- Battery , Harddisk and screen should easier to detachable in case of replacement.
- 7" screen no plastic frame. ( touch screen really hard to use with 5.5-inch screen consider this is laptop not smart phone)
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GPD removed the rumble feature... I mean what the hell kind of company is that? Sorry my language. Anyways, I am done with all these game consoles and manufacturers. I am selling my unreleased ALIEX GPD Win 1 and maybe even my Shield 2 prototype. If you want info PM me. good luck to all you GPD buyers... I am DONE...
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RE using Windows 8-10 without a keyboard, trust me it's a PITA. I was an early adopter of Bay Trail tablets and had wanted a Windows based gaming solution I could fit in my pocket for ages, before this I had touchscreen laptops so I was familiar with using Windows with touch gestures (and unlike everybody else I actually found it useful) and incorporated them into my normal OS usage.
The problem is that Windows is designed around KB and mouse input, although touch has been reasonably well retro-fitted into the OS it quickly becomes apparent that the many basic tasks and operations a user would perform during day to day use require KB and mouse to make them fast and intuitive. It's quite hard to explain but every time you have use a touch mouse (or analog stick mouse emulation) and/or go into the taskbar to manually bring up the touch keyboard (because it isn't always automatic like Android or IOS) it makes you want to use the device a little less - death by a million cuts so to speak. It becomes a chore to navigate and perform basic operations.
gonna give my 2 cents here its good to have more than one opinion on a subject. I to have spent a decent amount of time with keyboard less tablets the biggest problem that you have is mouse control something i fixed fairly quick with a program called touch mouse pointer after the average keyboard stuff that you would do on a device that is gaming focused tends to not need the keyboard like that basic file operations and web browsing i personally never found that big of a problem for me. when i did need to do a lot of typing i would connect a bt keyboard and use that. if gpd created a tablet version of the win 2 or 3 it would be very simple to connect a bt keyboard to for wen you need to type a whole lot it which would be a fairly rare thing for you to have to do.
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I had a completely different experience, seriously would not bother using Windows without a keyboard at all as it just gets on my nerves. Every little hindrance annoys me as OS use should be seamless just like it is in every other device I own, I don't have to fiddle around bringing a touch keyboard up in any other OS and I don't want to start doing it in 2018. Carrying a BT keyboard around with me is even less appealing as well as time consuming and cumbersome.
Of course YMMV, if you want a decent cheap BT keyboard/touchpad the KKMoon ones are nice to use, particularly the 81 key version.
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Love the thread title ;)
Anyhoo, here's the deal in a nutshell from my perspective:
1.) Intel 10nm is garbage and will probably leave Intel without anything meaningful for any singular <10watt SoC in 2019
2.) The biggest "problem" for the GPD Win 2 now is lack of GPU resources. That only gives us a few options (AND ALL of these options are 25-30 watts)
2a.) Amberlake + Nvidia MX150 (or MX250) = This is best combo but would have to cool two distinct places and makes device wider.
2b.) A single Intel solution available now, the 8109U. This is IntelHD655 and has 128MB of EDRAM (fast cache for CPU + GPU) But GPD probably can't even buy this chip in small quantities
2c.) AMD V1605B. Last I heard about this was lack of support when working with OEM. This could still happen but I think it's unlikely.
So basically 2019 doesn't give that many options and if there was going to be a GPD Win 3 it would need a significantly better GPU to even qualify as a big enough upgrade. And yes it would be more expensive than Win2.
The biggest problem here is the wattage. The Win2 battery is pretty massive (~40Watt Hour). If we used this same battery and ran it at 30watts (Probably have to go up to 14v or whatever, too many amps at 7.6v) the battery would only last 80 minutes. Without going crazy, if we hit 60 watt hour battery, it would probably be the best trade off between battery life and weight.
For those wanting a cheaper Win2 there is already an option available. It's the 3965Y: https://ark.intel.com/products/122698/Intel-Celeron-Processor-3965Y-2M-Cache-1-50-GHz-
This is mostly a 7y30 without Speedstep and a bit less cache. It would still offer close to 60-100% more perf over Win1 and is the same socket as 7Y30 (Read: Should be pretty much drop in compatible with Win2 board)
On linux you could play a lot of Gamecube titles with MESA Vulkan drivers, but on Windows we still need to wait for improved drivers and integration on Dolphin. OR just wait for VideoCommon to be updated on Dolphin and get DX12 support back in mainline Dolphin.
PS2 wouldn't be as good as Win2 proper, but some games would work. Mostly the 3965Y should offer 60% of CPU perf compared to 7Y30.
But technically a 3965Y Win2 "Lite" edition could probably be priced around $425-450
Obviously this is just technical side of chips we'll be able to use when trying to forecast what is most likely going to happen.
For features, I'd like:
Clickable Analog Sticks L3/R3
Analog L2/R2
Get rid of mouse / xinput switch
Instead install Optical Mouse sensor like P2 (just include Right-click and scroll function somewhere)
Always on Xbox controller and always on keyboard and mouse
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On linux you could play a lot of Gamecube titles with MESA Vulkan drivers, but on Windows we still need to wait for improved drivers and integration on Dolphin. OR just wait for VideoCommon to be updated on Dolphin and get DX12 support back in mainline Dolphin.
The question is if there's ever going to be an Intel HD Graphics driver with Vulkan support. It's really getting annoying because the GPD Win had the hardware to support it but no Intel HD Graphics drivers to support it. Now that I own a GPD Win 2 the Vulkan support is broken in the drivers. The latest drviers do NOT work for me. It's probably because I don't use the latest Windows 10 build and nobody really cares at Intel if it works or not. :(
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Vulkan drivers work in most emulators, only dolphin has some issues under windows (dpeending on the game). But on rpcs3 or retroarch vulkan works ok actually.
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Vulkan drivers work in most emulators, only dolphin has some issues under windows (dpeending on the game). But on rpcs3 or retroarch vulkan works ok actually.
Are you using the latest V25 drivers?
For me they don't work and it's still getting worse. With the first release it did break OpenGL and didn't load the Intel HD Graphics control panel. The second release didn't fix it. With the second release after installation and reboot I get asked again if I wan't to istall the drivers. It's an endless loop till I click "Cancel". Uninstall the drivers and go back to the last V24 drivers. ???
Edit: I also did try to install them with the Windows hardware manager but it doesn't make any difference. No error message just not working as they should.
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I use this ones, which are the latesr for intel hd 615.
https://downloadcenter.intel.com/download/28240/Intel-Graphics-Driver-for-Windows-10?product=96554
I have never had a single issue with openGL either. I use windows 1809 on win 2.
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These are the same drivers that I tried. They're also the drivers that are recommended by the Intel Update & Support Utility.
What I also did is run Windows DISM and SFC command but it didn't find any problems. No corrupted or missing files.
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That's strange then if you have issues. Maybe some windows update went wrong or something is missing in your windows, because those drivers run fine to me on 1809. Didn't try them on 1803 though.
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That's why I checked it with DISM and SFC and nothing seems to be wrong. ???
Edit: I did a bit of research and it looks like I'm not the only one with this issue. https://intel-openport-v8.hosted.jivesoftware.com/thread/129727 (https://intel-openport-v8.hosted.jivesoftware.com/thread/129727)
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Real HDMI (big one), no fan, IPS screen not mobile one, bigger screen, smaller bezels,possibility to add ram a change ssd with reasonable form factor, good wifi and bluetooth and finally good build quality. Bios where are items really working, or are hidden..
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Real HDMI (big one), no fan, IPS screen not mobile one, bigger screen, smaller bezels,possibility to add ram a change ssd with reasonable form factor, good wifi and bluetooth and finally good build quality. Bios where are items really working, or are hidden..
so......an HP Envy?
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Well...
I upgraded my GPD Win 2 to Windows 10 1803. There's absolutely no need to use and stay on a older build with the GPD Win 2. The DDraw full screen compatibility issue is still not fixed but maybe this is because display scaling now actually works with the new Intel HD graphics drivers.
The issues I had with the driver being unstable is just because of the old Windows 10 build I used that was no longer compatible with the new drivers.
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Here's an idea for the GPD Win 3: you could use Intel's new big.LITTLE CPU that is coming out next year: https://www.anandtech.com/show/13699/intel-architecture-day-2018-core-future-hybrid-x86/7
(https://images.anandtech.com/doci/13699/Foveros%20%281%29.jpg)
(https://images.anandtech.com/doci/13699/Foveros%20%288%29.jpg)
Super compact, 4 small "Atom" cores and one big "Core" core, and a nice wide 64EU GPU that will probably be super efficient when run at low clocks. Plus support for LPDDR4. And it is apparently targeting "sub-7W". Sounds perfect for a gaming handheld.
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Actually the Intel M.3 7y30 is more efficient than the atom in every way, consume less power for same tasks, and as much power idle so there's no need to switch to such Cpu.
Here's an idea for the GPD Win 3: you could use Intel's new big.LITTLE CPU that is coming out next year: https://www.anandtech.com/show/13699/intel-architecture-day-2018-core-future-hybrid-x86/7
(https://images.anandtech.com/doci/13699/Foveros%20%281%29.jpg)
(https://images.anandtech.com/doci/13699/Foveros%20%288%29.jpg)
Super compact, 4 small "Atom" cores and one big "Core" core, and a nice wide 64EU GPU that will probably be super efficient when run at low clocks. Plus support for LPDDR4. And it is apparently targeting "sub-7W". Sounds perfect for a gaming handheld.
Envoy? de mon G8441 en utilisant Tapatalk
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Actually the Intel M.3 7y30 is more efficient than the atom in every way, consume less power for same tasks, and as much power idle so there's no need to switch to such Cpu. Here's an idea for the GPD Win 3: you could use Intel's new big.LITTLE CPU that is coming out next year: https://www.anandtech.com/show/13699/intel-architecture-day-2018-core-future-hybrid-x86/7
(https://images.anandtech.com/doci/13699/Foveros%20%281%29.jpg)
(https://images.anandtech.com/doci/13699/Foveros%20%288%29.jpg)
Super compact, 4 small "Atom" cores and one big "Core" core, and a nice wide 64EU GPU that will probably be super efficient when run at low clocks. Plus support for LPDDR4. And it is apparently targeting "sub-7W". Sounds perfect for a gaming handheld.
Envoy? de mon G8441 en utilisant Tapatalk
The new Icelake core is meant to be much wider than Skylake, and the latest Atom cores are more capable than the old Silvermont derived cores. It's like four cores partway between the Win and Win2 in per-core performance, plus one BIG core.
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I think the main thing to take away from that is the 64EU cores which should be a nice boost in graphics power.
Depending on how fast the CPU is it maybe a nice alternative to the m3 y730 and m3 y8100.
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Small bezel and 7" screen for sure. I have the Mi Max 3 with the same screen and it is easily pocketable. Bezel size matters more than screen size to the final product size.
(https://www.justanaverageuser.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/10/Mi-Max-3-PUBG.jpg)
Right side here
(https://www.ixbt.com/live/uploads/images/03/04/74/2018/11/10/59f5029f51.jpg)
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Totally agree, you can easily fit a 7? screen in the Win2, the GPD Pocket screen would be a nice fit.
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Only things I could suggest as Improvements for the Win 3:
Clickable L/R 3 Joysticks
Screen Resolution able to be 1600x900 (Certain Apps, Cheat Happens Trainer Manager for example, runs higher than 1280x720, and can NOT be Resized)
Get rid of the Micro/Mini HDMI. Users can use a USB Adapter to connect to External Displays
For GPD XD next Gen Model -
Get rid of Micro/Mini HDMI and replace with Full USB-A Connector for USB Storage. This will be VERY useful if GPD Limits the Storage to 16/32GB . 64GB should be Standard, with 128GB as Special Edition. Or at least let Users be able to use M.2 SSD.
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May be simply remove controller from main body all together and make keyboard detachable.
it should look similar to this but smaller.
(https://i.ebayimg.com/00/s/ODE5WDEwMjQ=/z/FPcAAOSw44BYm0Xv/$_86.JPG)
[Benefits]
- It make device even smaller and might give extra space to add more thing inside for better performance or simply more usb slot.
- Touch screen easier to use with both hand while handheld.
- Allow player attach the device with 3rd party gamepad of choice which very cheap and easy to find in today market. (truly GPD can offer one themselve) now broken gamepad no longer affect to the device.
- Like gamepad..broken keyboard also not affect to main device and can easily replace with the new one.
- Device look more unique and nolonger look like copy of Nintendo device.
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May be simply remove controller from main body all together and make keyboard detachable.
it should look similar to this but smaller.
(https://i.ebayimg.com/00/s/ODE5WDEwMjQ=/z/FPcAAOSw44BYm0Xv/$_86.JPG)
[Benefits]
- It make device even smaller and might give extra space to add more thing inside for better performance or simply more usb slot.
- Touch screen easier to use with both hand while handheld.
- Allow player attach the device with 3rd party gamepad of choice which very cheap and easy to find in today market. (truly GPD can off one themselve) now broken gamepad no longer effect to the device.
- Like gamepad..detachable keyboard also not effect to main device and can easily replace with the new one.
- Device look more unique and nolonger look like copy of Nintendo device.
Sounds similar to the Linx Vision:
(https://cdn.game.net/image/upload/c_fill,dpr_4.0,f_auto,h_210,q_auto/v1/game_img/ml2/7/0/7/5/707572_gen_a.png)
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the different is GPD design would small enough to fit inside pocket.
I really don't like Linx Vision controller design... If I got one I would prefer using Ipega 9023 instead of it's official. XD
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So after using my WIN 2 for a couple of weeks now some things I would improve:
1) Bigger screen for sure.
While the screen is of good quality and overall very good W10 and gaming need more screen just to make things more easy on the eyes.
2) Have a fan that is not as loud if possible.
It doesnt bother me that much but it could still be improved.
3) clickable sticks.
I have got used to the L3/R3 placement but clickable sticks would just make everything so much easier.
4) use TGHoly idea of a tablet style
I would not mind GPD looking into making a tablet style model. You can use a 10 inch screen and still have room for a decent detachable keyboard.
Now that Im thinking about a 10/11 inch laptop with 1080p screen would be amazing and address all those issues.
You would have more room for better cooling and better fans that are not as loud, more room for full size ports and bigger battery while still being very portable.
Sort of like the MicroPC but bigger and slightly thinner and better specs.
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Yeah GPD PC tablet sound amazing! But truly I'm more expect PC gaming on my phone if possible, So... I don't have to hold both device at same time anymore event GPD phone might bulkier than many smart phone XD. (even better if that phone has GPD win2 performance)
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The WIN 3 should have the form factor of the OCOSMO OCS1 :
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tRTtm9iGihc
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I like the clamshell design, it protects everything inside.
Not a fan of slider mechanics and open air buttons for something meant to be put in your pocket.
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I like the clamshell design, it protects everything inside.
Not a fan of slider mechanics and open air buttons for something meant to be put in your pocket.
PSP Go worked for me with a simple neopren cover, but the controllers were too small for my hands.
Enviado desde mi SM-G950F mediante Tapatalk
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I think the problem with this design require user to hold it all the time and can't use as laptop which limit flexibility to play certain type of game such as RTS or Moba... in the end it's still Windows10 Pc not fully portable gaming device like PSP/PSV.
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I'd be a big fan of the Intel Iris chips for the next GPD. Give it quite a bit more graphics power, and wouldn't add a second chip. A low watt MX250 would be cool, that'd be my ultimate wish, but price would be very high and it'd be power hungry.
That said, it must have a keyboard. It isn't a UMPC without one- it's just a tablet.
The slider idea posted above is pretty cool- reminds me of this guy:
(https://www.dvhardware.net/news/sony_vaio_vgn_ux490nc.jpg)
which I enjoyed owning. Those were a lot more expensive too- 2,500$ if I remember correctly.
Some gaming controls on the side instead would be awesome!
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I am on the side of the clamshell design too.
Need:
1. More power
2. Backlit keyboard (with 3 settings for brightness and off function).
3. Move the d-pad and the front action buttons back to the outboard position and the analog sticks back to the inboard positions.
4. Make a little thinner.
5. Add front facing/rear facing cameras.
6. Better thermals for cooling.
7. Clickable analog sticks.
7. Better and more responsive/tighter d-pad (like on the nintendo/sony products).
Thanks.
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Some how I come with an idea about remove screen from device entirely and allow it to use phone / tablet as monitor instead. XD