Author Topic: N64 emulator?  (Read 14856 times)

Homeplanet (OP)

  • *
  • Posts: 28
N64 emulator?
« on: June 18, 2014, 05:39:16 pm »
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I've been looking around the forums and haven't found anything recent on it. N64 emulation IS definitely possible (it worked half-decently on the PSP, OoT Master Quest ran well) and I'm pretty sure 320x240 was the native resolution of the N64 with little variation. So is there any chance a dev could port something? Or if that doesn't pan out, point me somewhere to learn such things (compiling sources for the Zero, etc.)? I believe that Mupen64plus has a linux port already, so it would be (relatively) easier to port than others. (Or maybe I'm just completely wrong and there's no chance on N64 happening, in which case tell me before I'm too hyped up)
ARGHGHEHGHGH - Chewbacca

Words to live by

kami1357

  • *
  • Posts: 15
Re: N64 emulator?
« Reply #1 on: June 18, 2014, 07:12:03 pm »
I don't think anyone ported it yet, or at last tried.

A raw port might give something great (just as psx4all) but a lot of works is to optimize the code...

Perhaps someone with programming skills could give it a try


forphucksakes

  • *
  • Posts: 71
Re: N64 emulator?
« Reply #2 on: January 21, 2015, 07:07:58 am »
Hi guys,

So I went to groups who I thought would be able to help out with an N64 emulator for the GCW0. So far Ive gotten 2xNO(Exophase,Marathonman), 1xMaybe(Mupen64+), 1x No Reply(DaedalusX64)

Exophase : http://www.drastic-ds.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=2395
Mupen64+ : https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/mupen64plus/kIlJdNEPlPI
CEN64: http://forums.cen64.com/viewforum.php?f=8
DaedalusX64: http://forums.daedalusx64.com/viewtopic.php?f=84&t=4325

Ive been told by an ex-daedalus dev that the project is dead and everybody's moved onto other things so I dont expect much as a response from them. Cen64 is probably abit out of GCW0's league (being an accurate simulator and all) and I expect the response to be along those lines but no reason to not put it out there anyways.

FPS
« Last Edit: January 22, 2015, 07:09:39 am by forphucksakes »
forphucksakes

Nebuleon

  • Guest
Re: N64 emulator?
« Reply #3 on: January 21, 2015, 09:00:35 am »
The response from 'Narann ([email protected])' on the mupen64plus thread seems more like an "I won't do it, but if you do it I won't hinder your progress", i.e. no, than a maybe.

CEN64 is already out of the question. I already know it'd far too demanding for the GCW Zero, and I haven't even compiled it.

forphucksakes

  • *
  • Posts: 71
Re: N64 emulator?
« Reply #4 on: January 21, 2015, 09:17:16 am »
Quote
There is some dev activities around dynarec[1] so I guess it's a good time to go but you have to motivate original devs, dynarec is not something you copy paste over code.

Second, I'm maybe wrong on this but Daedalus is not write like mupen64plus so it wouldn't be so easy. Yet Daedalus code would be a very good resource for anyone wanting to add MIPS32r2 dynarec to mupen64plus.

I personally think he's addressing the m64+ community on at least looking at the Daedalus dynarec as a reference for anyone willing to take it up.

The response from 'Narann (???@yahoo.com)' on the mupen64plus thread seems more like an "I won't do it, but if you do it I won't hinder your progress", i.e. no, than a maybe.

Im assuming youre refering to this closing comment on his second post:
Quote
Anyway, if anyone have skills and motivation to create a MIPS32 branch for the dynarec for mupen64plus it would be appreciate. :)
I guess its just a matter of perspective but the way I read it is more along the lines of "to all the motivated/skilled M64+ devs out there it would be appreciated if a MIPS32 branch was added to m64+'s dynarec branch"

Which imo is definitely not a "Yes" nor a "No"(m64+ is a community effort after all) I figured if someone motivated/skilled enough (in the M64+ community) steps up and gives it a looksee... it qualifies as a maybe. Then again its just perspective.Perspective is funny aint it?
« Last Edit: January 21, 2015, 09:32:45 am by forphucksakes »
forphucksakes

xXFrostXx

  • * Former Staff
  • Posts: 234
Re: N64 emulator?
« Reply #5 on: January 21, 2015, 03:57:18 pm »
Mupen64Plus would likely work out the best.

Though, button mapping would need to be thought out for the N64 emulator. We have a dpad, thumbstick, two triggers, and four face buttons.

Mentioning that, we would have X and Y free, but we need the Z trigger and the C buttons mapped.
I'm hoping this idea progresses, I just want to point out that button mapping may require button combinations like psx4all used.
Dingoonity is the place to be!

pcercuei

  • ***
  • Posts: 1432
    • My devblog
Re: N64 emulator?
« Reply #6 on: January 21, 2015, 04:42:28 pm »
No, there are no problems with the buttons, for one simple reason: due to the shape of the N64 controller, the games either handle stick + Z or they handle dpad + L. So you could have different modes in the emulator; the default one being when Z is on L and the C buttons are on the d-pad.

But the button layout is REALLY not the concern here.

First, you need a fast dynamic recompiler from MIPS64 to MIPS32. That piece of code alone would need several months of work for a very experienced software engineer working 40h/week on it. And nobody is going to do that.

Second, the video plugin. The modern video cards are programmed completely differently than they were in the past and that's a big problem for us, because our GPU will only give an acceptable performance for programs that have been written in a modern (GLESv2) way. Last time I checked, the most mobile-friendly GPU plugin (gles2n64) was not light enough to run well on the GCW0 at more than ~10fps. So that's probably all we can get.

Aeter

  • *
  • Posts: 322
Re: N64 emulator?
« Reply #7 on: January 21, 2015, 05:00:03 pm »
No, there are no problems with the buttons, for one simple reason: due to the shape of the N64 controller, the games either handle stick + Z or they handle dpad + L. So you could have different modes in the emulator; the default one being when Z is on L and the C buttons are on the d-pad.

But the button layout is REALLY not the concern here.

First, you need a fast dynamic recompiler from MIPS64 to MIPS32. That piece of code alone would need several months of work for a very experienced software engineer working 40h/week on it. And nobody is going to do that.

Second, the video plugin. The modern video cards are programmed completely differently than they were in the past and that's a big problem for us, because our GPU will only give an acceptable performance for programs that have been written in a modern (GLESv2) way. Last time I checked, the most mobile-friendly GPU plugin (gles2n64) was not light enough to run well on the GCW0 at more than ~10fps. So that's probably all we can get.
Well I guess n64 ain't gonna happen then.
I do remember some GCW0 screen shot with a n64 emulator on it, but I guess that is all we'll ever since there too many things not available and won't be in the near future.

Is it possible to get better results with a psx emulator though?
~cucullus non facit monachum~

pcercuei

  • ***
  • Posts: 1432
    • My devblog
Re: N64 emulator?
« Reply #8 on: January 21, 2015, 05:04:38 pm »
Yes, a PSX emulator is still a big task but definitely possible:
- you recompile 32-bit code and not 64-bit code, so the recompiler is much simpler (but that's still an enormous task that requires a lot of time)
- the graphics are much simpler.

Aeter

  • *
  • Posts: 322
Re: N64 emulator?
« Reply #9 on: January 21, 2015, 05:12:53 pm »
Yes, a PSX emulator is still a big task but definitely possible:
- you recompile 32-bit code and not 64-bit code, so the recompiler is much simpler (but that's still an enormous task that requires a lot of time)
- the graphics are much simpler.
Wouldn't it be easier trying to improve psx4all in that case?
~cucullus non facit monachum~

xXFrostXx

  • * Former Staff
  • Posts: 234
Re: N64 emulator?
« Reply #10 on: January 21, 2015, 06:48:59 pm »
Yes, a PSX emulator is still a big task but definitely possible:
- you recompile 32-bit code and not 64-bit code, so the recompiler is much simpler (but that's still an enormous task that requires a lot of time)
- the graphics are much simpler.
Wouldn't it be easier trying to improve psx4all in that case?

Every game I tried on psx4all ran very well, there were just some sound issues. Sound crackling and lag. If that could be fixed, psx4all may actually be usable.

I was able to play Megaman Legends until I heard Roll's voice and it sounded like "Megaman BZZRT RTZZRA ZZ".
« Last Edit: January 21, 2015, 07:03:20 pm by xXFrostXx »
Dingoonity is the place to be!

lemmywinks

  • ****
  • Posts: 2775
Re: N64 emulator?
« Reply #11 on: January 21, 2015, 08:35:26 pm »
No, there are no problems with the buttons, for one simple reason: due to the shape of the N64 controller, the games either handle stick + Z or they handle dpad + L. So you could have different modes in the emulator; the default one being when Z is on L and the C buttons are on the d-pad.

But the button layout is REALLY not the concern here.

That's kinda not correct. For some N64 games you need either 6 face buttons or a 4 way dpad/analog on the right. This is because some games use the A and B as primary action buttons but also use the C buttons either for direct aiming/movement (Goldeneye) or are used in conjunction with the analog stick (Zelda OOT/MM).

So the common way of working around this in emulation is for the C buttons to be mapped to a right analog stick, otherwise it's just a royal PITA. Sure you could remap certain functions to get around this like mapping less essential C buttons to a dpad key (had to do this on my old JXD) but it's still nowhere near as good as 6 face buttons or a right analog and would make some games pretty awkward.

I guess you could have preset profiles which launch automatically (same with L/Z issues) but it would still be an undesirable workaround.
Handhelds:
GPD Win, GPD XD 64gb, Pap KIII-Plus, RS-97, RS-90, New Bittboy, 3DS XL, DSi XL, GBA SP, GBBC Clone, Gameboy Pocket, PSP Go,
PC:
HP Envy M6, Acer 522, Dell Mini 9
Psion 5 & 5MX
Tons of other old laptops and tablets.....

xXFrostXx

  • * Former Staff
  • Posts: 234
Re: N64 emulator?
« Reply #12 on: January 29, 2015, 11:16:14 pm »
I guess you could have preset profiles which launch automatically (same with L/Z issues) but it would still be an undesirable workaround.

But the fact we could play N64... we would get used to it. Haha.
Dingoonity is the place to be!

lemmywinks

  • ****
  • Posts: 2775
Re: N64 emulator?
« Reply #13 on: January 30, 2015, 11:18:53 am »
Yeah true, I played through quite a bit of Zelda OOT on a console with a PSP style layout before I upgraded it, much better when you don't have to do that though. Mind you if you want to play that game then just get it on 3DS, it's ace!
Handhelds:
GPD Win, GPD XD 64gb, Pap KIII-Plus, RS-97, RS-90, New Bittboy, 3DS XL, DSi XL, GBA SP, GBBC Clone, Gameboy Pocket, PSP Go,
PC:
HP Envy M6, Acer 522, Dell Mini 9
Psion 5 & 5MX
Tons of other old laptops and tablets.....

xXFrostXx

  • * Former Staff
  • Posts: 234
Re: N64 emulator?
« Reply #14 on: January 30, 2015, 02:54:26 pm »
Yeah true, I played through quite a bit of Zelda OOT on a console with a PSP style layout before I upgraded it, much better when you don't have to do that though. Mind you if you want to play that game then just get it on 3DS, it's ace!

I haven't gotten Zelda OoT 3D yet, but I plan to. If only they'd release a 3D version of Banjo-Kazooie and Kirby 64.
Dingoonity is the place to be!

lemmywinks

  • ****
  • Posts: 2775
Re: N64 emulator?
« Reply #15 on: January 30, 2015, 04:35:14 pm »
Get it, it's great! Also get Space Harrier 3D if you haven't already, that's pure class.
Handhelds:
GPD Win, GPD XD 64gb, Pap KIII-Plus, RS-97, RS-90, New Bittboy, 3DS XL, DSi XL, GBA SP, GBBC Clone, Gameboy Pocket, PSP Go,
PC:
HP Envy M6, Acer 522, Dell Mini 9
Psion 5 & 5MX
Tons of other old laptops and tablets.....

Xaijiqq

  • *
  • Posts: 410
Re: N64 emulator?
« Reply #16 on: January 30, 2015, 07:19:17 pm »
ah yes the sega 3d classics :) recently got afterburner II which is nice.  they're suppose to release outrun in march and thunder blade in may,, wow those will be incredible!

lemmywinks

  • ****
  • Posts: 2775
Re: N64 emulator?
« Reply #17 on: January 30, 2015, 10:34:42 pm »
Was wondering about Afterburner, the Hang On version wasn't as good I don't think - still good but not must-have like Space Harrier so I wasn't as excited about the other Sega stuff. Not sure about the others but Space Harrier isn't actually a port, it's completely remade for the 3DS. Will be buying Outrun anyway, been playing loads of Coast 2 Coast on the PSP recently which is a great game, very underrated. Like a cross between the original game and Ridge Racer.
Handhelds:
GPD Win, GPD XD 64gb, Pap KIII-Plus, RS-97, RS-90, New Bittboy, 3DS XL, DSi XL, GBA SP, GBBC Clone, Gameboy Pocket, PSP Go,
PC:
HP Envy M6, Acer 522, Dell Mini 9
Psion 5 & 5MX
Tons of other old laptops and tablets.....

xXFrostXx

  • * Former Staff
  • Posts: 234
Re: N64 emulator?
« Reply #18 on: January 31, 2015, 04:45:28 am »
I think the subject of the thread kind of got derailed... haha.

I think we should go back to discussing N64 (and PSX) on the GCW-Zero.
Dingoonity is the place to be!

lemmywinks

  • ****
  • Posts: 2775
Re: N64 emulator?
« Reply #19 on: January 31, 2015, 09:53:32 am »
There's not much to discuss really, there isn't an N64 emulator for it and there isn't one in the works. Everything about N64 on the Zero has pretty much already been discussed, plus this was originally a necro-thread from last year too!
Handhelds:
GPD Win, GPD XD 64gb, Pap KIII-Plus, RS-97, RS-90, New Bittboy, 3DS XL, DSi XL, GBA SP, GBBC Clone, Gameboy Pocket, PSP Go,
PC:
HP Envy M6, Acer 522, Dell Mini 9
Psion 5 & 5MX
Tons of other old laptops and tablets.....

 

Post a new topic
Post a new topic