Author Topic: Existential question on Dingux  (Read 10951 times)

cronot

  • Posts: 48
Re: Existential question on Dingux
« Reply #20 on: December 12, 2011, 11:04:48 am »
Legacy has no actual technical advantages. The only reason some applications work in legacy and don't in OD is because of bad programming habits like static-linking or directly accessing the filesystem pathes for various hardware (overclock, volume, tv-out), which ultimately makes the given software work only on a particular version of the system and makes it incompatible with os updates that introduce changes in that matter. I'm personally guilty of such practices - some of my very old ports were static linked against ancient libraries.

FTFY. I'm sorry if that comes off harsh, it's not my intention at all, but if you have like 1/3 to 1/2 of apps/games/emulators that work on legacy not working on OD, then I can't see any advantage at all on that from an end-user standpoint. Last I've seen, there are a few emulators (mainly for arcade) still not ported over to OD (usually because there's no source for them and the original contributors have left the scene), and a lot of games/engines haven't been ported too - I'm specifically looking at Ur-Quan Masters, OpenTyrian and OpenBor, and last I've looked, games based on the Doom Engine (Doom 1/2, Heretic, Hexen, etc.) also didn't work. I may be outdated though, so corrections are welcome. The wiki is offline, so it's even harder to keep track of things now.

Quote
And related, do you even ever boot in Native anymore? Of just always in Dingux?

I do boot into native very often, with a bit of disgust I might add, for a single reason: NES emulator. Unfortunately, even at this day and age, there are still no good NES emulators for either Legacy Dingux or Opendingux. The ones that do exist for Legacy Dingux are no good at all - they mostly suffer from stuttering or horrible sound lags.

Well, I'll go back and duck in my corner now, waiting for the flames... :-)

Coccijoe

  • Posts: 366
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Re: Existential question on Dingux
« Reply #21 on: December 12, 2011, 12:05:53 pm »
You're right for arcade emulator (fba and mame)
But Opentyrian, OpenBor, doom engine, heretic, hexen run on OpenDingux
Actually after testing lot of game i think it's less than 1/10 (for the games that runs on legacy and not on OD).
May be you're priority is to play these emulators or game, if not, there will be an advantage to use OD.
« Last Edit: December 12, 2011, 12:12:49 pm by Coccijoe »

zear

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Re: Existential question on Dingux
« Reply #22 on: December 12, 2011, 12:53:09 pm »
There's a simple rule what doesn't work:
1) it's statically linked against old libs
2) it accesses cpu overclock, tv-out or other hardware directly via built-in menus rather than gmenu2x

#1 is mainly the oldest game ports
#2 is pretty much limited to certain emulators

There's really just a few apps that don't work in OD, unfortunatelly for some it's popular emulators

FTFY. I'm sorry if that comes off harsh, it's not my intention at all, but if you have like 1/3 to 1/2 of apps/games/emulators that work on legacy not working on OD, then I can't see any advantage at all on that from an end-user standpoint. Last I've seen, there are a few emulators (mainly for arcade) still not ported over to OD (usually because there's no source for them and the original contributors have left the scene), and a lot of games/engines haven't been ported too - I'm specifically looking at Ur-Quan Masters, OpenTyrian and OpenBor, and last I've looked, games based on the Doom Engine (Doom 1/2, Heretic, Hexen, etc.) also didn't work. I may be outdated though, so corrections are welcome. The wiki is offline, so it's even harder to keep track of things now.
There's another side of it. If legacy was left as a standard, you'd complain about the difficulty of the installation and handling of it. When there's finally people improving the alternative firmware for Dingoo A320, there's complaints about compatibility which in no way originates from OpenDingux, but rather the unability to recompile certain apps due to the lack of their source code. I understand that for some people OpenDingux is not yet usable because they miss their favourite emulators, but on the other hand the completely rewritten drivers and support for hardware surface should ultimately boost the speed of emulation, as soon as the emulators in question get an OpenDingux port.

As for the doom engine games, they all work fine. There's even a new port of Heretic & Hexen that makes them 100% playable (as opposed to the older ports which had no way to cycle items/weapons or look up/down)
« Last Edit: December 12, 2011, 01:21:17 pm by zear »

CREATICA

  • Posts: 195
Re: Existential question on Dingux
« Reply #23 on: December 12, 2011, 01:09:30 pm »
At this moment, I don't see the actual advantage of OD either . The emulation runs, more or less, at the same speed. That's what I've read in this forum.  Otherwise, and maybe, in one year or two the situation has turned around. Besides  it's clear the word "pre-release" in every release of OD which denotes something still incomplete and it's normal because creating a whole new system from the scratch is a very time-consuming task.
So my recommendation would be stick with legacy and stay vigilant  (on a long term) of OD for new releases.  Take on mind that  I've seen posts talking about the idea of one OD which are dated almost one year and a half ago. So if you're impatient you know what you should do.

Anyway, perhaps a new wave of cheap android handheld consoles conquer the retro-gaming scene in two years and Dingoo is forgotten into oblivion for good (like what happened to gp2x among others), so you better don't care much about the future. It doesn't pay off. Enjoy what you already have and whatever it gets the job done. This is the most practical approaching to this subject.

« Last Edit: December 12, 2011, 01:18:45 pm by CREATICA »

cronot

  • Posts: 48
Re: Existential question on Dingux
« Reply #24 on: December 12, 2011, 03:05:40 pm »
@coccijoe & @zear:
I stand corrected regarding Doom engine games and others. Still hoping for a port of Ur-Quan though :-)

And yes, I get that sticking with legacy means supporting a broken platform - I'm a software developer myself (though not focused on embedded platforms at the moment), and I understand the burden it is and that many problems on legacy platforms can be fixed only by rewriting everything from scratch. I also understand the chicken and egg problem that brings, and that you mention: the newer platform may not necessarily support the older stuff, but it fixes long standing problems on the legacy platform.

I think part of the problem could be mitigated by dropping the "pre-release" status on OD already - from the looks of it, it seems to be at least as stable and functional (barring userspace incompatibilities) as legacy dingux. I think that would raise the mindshare on OD and maybe attract more developers to develop for it. I say this because I've seen a couple of emu/app releases lately that apparently still targeted legacy.

While being a software dev, I use the dingoo primarily as an end-user, so I also understand where the frustration from creatica comes from: The Dingoo / Dingux is supposed to be primarily a platform for emulation fans, and yet, the emulation part of it still lacks in many aspects. Case in point, the NES emulator I mentioned previously. I could go on about how SNES emu is also still so-so, despite the source being available. I mean, for a platform that's supposed to be for emulation, the most popular emulation platforms (NES, SNES, Genesis, etc.) have sub-par support, and instead we get emulation for completely obscure or niche platforms like Atari Lynx, and Vectrex (seriously?). The gist of my point is, it seems we have a lot of talented developers working on the core platform and/or on their own pet projects, but there doesn't seem to exist as much interest on the part that really matters: userspace, and the more popular stuff. And that's frustrating.
« Last Edit: December 12, 2011, 03:11:22 pm by cronot »

pcercuei

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Re: Existential question on Dingux
« Reply #25 on: December 12, 2011, 04:15:16 pm »
We're not paid. We don't get any benefit in working on dingoo stuff.
So if you people rage because you don't get your super-cool SNES / PSX emu, just open a C/C++ book and go.

cronot

  • Posts: 48
Re: Existential question on Dingux
« Reply #26 on: December 12, 2011, 05:17:59 pm »
Look, I'm not demanding anything, I know you guys are just scratching your own itch and just happen to share it with everyone else, which is all well and good. In fact, I don't mind the core platform (OD) getting more attention so much as I mind so much talent being wasted in useless (to most people) userspace stuff (meaning emulators/games) like I mentioned previously.

But I digress. Yes, I wish I had the time to spend on scratching those itches of mine too, but between a wife, two kids and already getting paid to work on software dev, there's not too much time or energy left to do anything else but play around :-P

pcercuei

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Re: Existential question on Dingux
« Reply #27 on: December 12, 2011, 05:43:04 pm »
Developers have lives too.
What I mean is that you have the right to be frustrated by the lack of work on emulators, but you can't blame developers for the current situation. They do what they want.

atari_afternoon

  • Posts: 62
Re: Existential question on Dingux
« Reply #28 on: December 12, 2011, 07:55:33 pm »
Personally, I am grateful for all Dingoo enthusiasts that make games and emulators I enjoy hours with and I don?t mind registering here just to say thank you to them :)

lemmywinks

  • Posts: 2795
Re: Existential question on Dingux
« Reply #29 on: December 12, 2011, 09:36:30 pm »
Personally, I am grateful for all Dingoo enthusiasts that make games and emulators I enjoy hours with and I don?t mind registering here just to say thank you to them :)

Yep, huuuuuge +1 here.

Dingoo/Dingux is what it is. I happen to think it's pretty good, the device can do much more than I ever expected it to when I bought it and that is due in no small part to people who dedicate some of their time to developing software for it.

Cheers guys!
Handhelds:
GPD Win, GPD XD 64gb, RS-97, RS-90, 3DS XL, DSi XL, GBA SP, GBBC Clone, Gameboy Pocket, PSP Go
PC:
Medion Erazer, Toshiba Z20t, Dell Mini 9, Psion 5MX
Tons of other old laptops and tablets.....

sdinjens

  • Guest
Re: Existential question on Dingux
« Reply #30 on: December 12, 2011, 09:58:37 pm »
Well, after a personal hotline, all is in order! Great thanks to Ayla, Zear and Surkow for (1) convincing me to go OD, (2) peptalks and instructions and (3) an enjoyable evening with oldskool irc.

Thanks!

 

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