MIPS Creator CI20 development board

[forphucksakes (OP)]

http://blog.imgtec.com/powervr/mips-creator-ci20-development-board-now-available

Technical specs:

    Processor: 1.2 GHz dual-core, MIPS32-based Ingenic JZ4780 SoC, 32kB L1 I- and D-cache, 512kB L2 cache
    FPU: IEEE754 Floating Point Unit, XBurst MXU
    Multimedia: PowerVR SGX540 GPU, hardware-accelerated video playback up to 1080p at 60 fps
    Memory: 1 GB DDR3 SDRAM, 4 GB flash memory, 1 x SD card
    Audio: AC97 audio, via 4-pin input/output jack and HDMI connector
    Camera interface: ITU-R BT.645 controller
    Connectivity: 10/100 Ethernet, 802.11 b/g/n, Bluetooth 4.0
    Display: 1 x HDMI up to 2K resolution
    USB: 1 x USB host, 1 x USB OTG device
    I/O peripherals: 2 x UART, 25 x GPIO, 2 x SPI, I2C, ADC, expansion headers, 14-pin ETAG connector

[zhongtiao1]

Could this become the better version of the gcw-zero since it has 1GB of RAM?

[forphucksakes (OP)]

If you can mod it into a handheld console with a battery(+charging system),LCD display, gaming I/O and have the OS & emulators ready sure it would be one heck of a portable console(assuming all that modification doesnt hinder its portability...mind you the board's dimensions are ~10cmx10cm!). Though honestly IMHO it would probably be best as a stand alone parallel device. i.e. a desktop companion to the GCW0(sync your game files over wifi and pick up right from where you left off at the subway or vice versa) OR as a development platform for the GCW0(since it comes with Debian complete with the GCC tools etc and its CPU is the sister to the GCW0's MIPS32 JX4770).

[Pardue]

I've seen a few news stories about this device but I'm wondering if it'll be able to capture the same community the Pi has. If it does that would be win-win for everyone.

As the world keeps turning, the Zero becomes a hard sell. Even the Nvidia Shield is $140 now. Eeek!

Here's an idea: sell Dingux as software to the ci20 community, then use those funds to design and market a handheld shell that has everything you describe (+ or - the board, depending on price). Then again that all depends on if people are willing to buy dingux and that's a big if since I'm sure tons of open source emulators are going to be ported anyways.

[forphucksakes (OP)]

I've seen a few news stories about this device but I'm wondering if it'll be able to capture the same community the Pi has. If it does that would be win-win for everyone.

I dont think the same community that embraced the pi will adopt the CI20(they probably will have a "oh another pi competitor?" attitude) though there is huge potential for the Dingoonity retro/indie gaming community to do so since there are already two consoles and a ton of software out there that can/could run on this platform.

Here's an idea: sell Dingux as software to the ci20 community, then use those funds to design and market a handheld shell that has everything you describe (+ or - the board, depending on price). Then again that all depends on if people are willing to buy dingux and that's a big if since I'm sure tons of open source emulators are going to be ported anyways.

I think that there is great potential for cross-community collaboration which will not only improve the quality of CI20 & GCW0's software support but also, in due course, may lead to/influence the development of a successor to the GCW0/CI20. As for making a new handheld with the CI20, I think it would be a while before anyone attempts another "full scale" production run like the GCW0, not at least until both the CI20/GCW0 & its software has had a chance to mature(and,IMHO, for it to have any added value a CI20 based psx/n64/dreamcast emulator has to exist)

Until then maybe some industrious modder could come up with a proof of concept CI20 shell and produce an instructable online. Then when all the ducks are in place, maybe the design could be developed into a kickstarter project for mass production.

[forphucksakes (OP)]

Hi mth thanks for your reply on the CI20 on the other thread(http://boards.dingoonity.org/gcw-general/could-opendingux-be-installed-on-this-thing/msg118093/#new). Very illuminating for those of us without physical access to the board(yet!).

Just wondering, can an LCD screen be connected directly to the board(via SPI or some physical hack?)

Also do you think that the CI20 would be capable of handling psx/n64/dreamcast emulation or is it still not beefy enough?

[mth]

Just wondering, can an LCD screen be connected directly to the board(via SPI or some physical hack?)

Maybe; the expansion ports export the SSI0 and SSI1 pins, which should be capable of hardware SPI. I don't know have experience with that kind of screen yet though, so I don't know if there are nasty practical details that would prevent it from working.

Also do you think that the CI20 would be capable of handling psx/n64/dreamcast emulation or is it still not beefy enough?

Single core performance is about 20% higher than the Zero (seems to scale roughly linear with the clock speed), so that is not a game changer. It does have two cores, so if an emulator would be able to distribute work over two cores efficiently (this is not always possible) it could run significantly faster.

In the case of PSX, the Pandora has approximately the same compute power as the Zero and it runs PSX emulation pretty well, so I think what is missing on the Zero (and also on CI20) is a highly optimized emulator rather than raw power.

N64 and DC take more power to emulate; I don't know if those would be feasible or not.

[forphucksakes (OP)]

It does have two cores, so if an emulator would be able to distribute work over two cores efficiently (this is not always possible) it could run significantly faster.

Isnt that what the NEON plugin on PCSXReARMed does? Only instead of a second similar core, it utilizes the NEON co-processor to offload some work?

In the case of PSX, the Pandora has approximately the same compute power as the Zero and it runs PSX emulation pretty well, so I think what is missing on the Zero (and also on CI20) is a highly optimized emulator rather than raw power.

N64 and DC take more power to emulate; I don't know if those would be feasible or not.

Doesnt the pandora do both DC & N64?

[mth]

It does have two cores, so if an emulator would be able to distribute work over two cores efficiently (this is not always possible) it could run significantly faster.

Isnt that what the NEON plugin on PCSXReARMed does? Only instead of a second similar core, it utilizes the NEON co-processor to offload some work?

Probably: I never dug into PSX emulation but the vector processing would be an important thing to accelerate.

Doesnt the pandora do both DC & N64?

I don't know; I never got the one I pre-ordered from Craig. EvilDragon offers a discount to people who didn't get their unit, but at this point I'd rather wait for Pyra than get a Pandora.

The question though is whether it emulates at a speed and accuracy that make it feasible to play actual games. If I recall correctly, we have DC emulation on the Zero, but it's too slow to be useful for most games.

I played Spyro on Pandora at GamesCom and thought that ran well, so for PSX I can say it's usable in practice.

[forphucksakes (OP)]

So technically one potential avenue for psx emulator optimization would be the ability to use one of the cores on the CI20 for vector processing?

The question though is whether it emulates at a speed and accuracy that make it feasible to play actual games. If I recall correctly, we have DC emulation on the Zero, but it's too slow to be useful for most games.

True, but judging by the videos on youtube reicast on pandora seems very playable(or at least has set the stage for the Pyra):

http://boards.openpandora.org/topic/15211-reicast-dreamcast-emulator/page-15
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ADzGqokbwi8

IIRC the reicast developers booted the BIOS and then pretty much abandoned GCW0 dev. for ARM/Android based systems. IMHO I dont think they even really tried(my opinion)... so I guess at the end it really is whether or not the devs have the time/inclination to work on the GCW0/CI20.  This is probably the case with n64 emulation as well:

http://pandorawiki.org/Mupen2.0_Compatibility_List#section_2

cant be the hardware as you've pointed out its comparatively capable to the pandora.

the Pandora has approximately the same compute power as the Zero

One thing that I notice with the Pandora and other devices(Wiz Canoo etc) is the effect that overclocking has on emulation performance: Can the CI20 be overclocked? If so by how much?

[forphucksakes (OP)]

Here's an analogous RPI 4.3" TFT LCD + touchscreen over SPI implementation :
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IDMe5PkReMw
Here's one running a little movie + pacman clone:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IQPbRedvg0E
 
http://www.hwlevel.com/hwlevel/RPiDisplays/RPiDisplays.html :

Our display modules provide a TFT LCD display, a resistive touchscreen with controller and tactile switches. They are connected over SPI bus and are besides for the Raspberry Pi therefore also suitable for all embedded systems with SPI bus. Especially for ones that do not have a LCD controller or are lacking I/O pins. Our displays only need SPI pins (MISO, MOSI, SCK, SPICS0 and SPICS1) to work.

http://www.4dsystems.com.au/product/4DPi_32/